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Man Up - Repealing "Don't Ask Don't Tell "

GH2001

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Re: Man Up - Repealing "Don't Ask Don't Tell "
« Reply #320 on: March 23, 2010, 01:53:35 PM »
Wrong again, Sweetheart...  It's pissing when you spin the discussion way off-topic in an attempt to prove some silly semi-related position. 
Way to go with the "quote" function!  Some people still haven't figured it out in here.  The only problem is that you forgot what initiated my little jab...
Followed by...So, piss and whine all you want...  Rather than refuting my jab, you went down some silly criminal argument that's completely unrelated to this.  Wacko, if you ask me...
Along the way, through our little exchange, I've said that I'm no expert several times.  Rather than accept that, you challenged my positions with your own rants, points and specs of research.  I said that I was leaving the final say with the General, and you're still making this about me.  Perhaps, if you didn't rant like a know-it-all expert on everything under the sun, you'd have a little more credibility on the board. 
You've lost me.  You were the one who said...  Oh nevermind...  I'm done fooling with your silly-assed pissing matches.  Grow up.  Experience some life... successes and failures.  Establish some perspective.  And, let me know when you're ready to discuss something without Googling for the latest lamestream opinion. 

Quit kicking the poor guy. He's endured enough of your ass rapings in this thread. He reminds me of Apollo Creed in Rocky IV right before the Russian killed him.

GarMan gets it.
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GarMan

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Re: Man Up - Repealing "Don't Ask Don't Tell "
« Reply #321 on: March 23, 2010, 02:28:06 PM »
Quit kicking the poor guy. He's endured enough of your ass rapings in this thread. He reminds me of Apollo Creed in Rocky IV right before the Russian killed him.

GarMan gets it.
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My rule of life prescribed as an absolutely sacred rite smoking cigars and also the drinking of alcohol before, after and if need be during all meals and in the intervals between them.  - Winston Churchill

Eating and sleeping are the only activities that should be allowed to interrupt a man's enjoyment of his cigar.  - Mark Twain

Nothing says "Obey Me" like a bloody head on a fence post!  - Stewie Griffin

"Every government interference in the economy consists of giving an unearned benefit, extorted by force, to some men at the expense of others."  - Ayn Rand

AUChizad

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Re: Man Up - Repealing "Don't Ask Don't Tell "
« Reply #322 on: March 23, 2010, 08:03:22 PM »
Quit kicking the poor guy. He's endured enough of your ass rapings in this thread. He reminds me of Apollo Creed in Rocky IV right before the Russian killed him.

GarMan gets it.
How anyone can interpret the events that have taken place between VV & Garman in any of these threads is both amazing and frightening at the same time.
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Kaos

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Re: Man Up - Repealing "Don't Ask Don't Tell "
« Reply #323 on: March 23, 2010, 09:41:22 PM »
How anyone can interpret the events that have taken place between VV & Garman in any of these threads is both amazing and frightening at the same time.

It's pretty obvious that VV is drowning in all these threads.  He's been dropkicked from hell to breakfast. 

Doesn't take a genius to see it.
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AUChizad

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Re: Man Up - Repealing "Don't Ask Don't Tell "
« Reply #324 on: March 23, 2010, 10:02:00 PM »
It's pretty obvious that VV is drowning in all these threads.  He's been dropkicked from hell to breakfast. 

Doesn't take a genius to see it.
It sure doesn't. It takes a moron.
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Kaos

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Re: Man Up - Repealing "Don't Ask Don't Tell "
« Reply #325 on: March 23, 2010, 10:05:36 PM »
It sure doesn't. It takes a moron.

Then it ought to be crystal clear to you. 
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GH2001

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Re: Man Up - Repealing "Don't Ask Don't Tell "
« Reply #326 on: March 24, 2010, 09:22:50 AM »
How anyone can interpret the events that have taken place between VV & Garman in any of these threads is both amazing and frightening at the same time.

Interpreting the events that took place between the Ivan Drago and Apollo is definitely amazing and frightening! So there ya go Chad.   Now - are you jumping in here due to feeling sorry for VV? I am just curious - no , seriously.
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AUChizad

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Re: Man Up - Repealing "Don't Ask Don't Tell "
« Reply #327 on: March 24, 2010, 02:19:25 PM »
Because responding to cold hard facts with such compelling arguments as:
Right...  Do you think before you type this stuff?  Explicit?  Really??? 
Wow...  Are you kidding me?  That's incredible.  You're a master of the American English language in your own mind.  I'm going to let you sit in your own scat for a while. 
Quote
Right...  Yeah...  OK... 
Quote
This is unbelievable.  Wake me up when you're done espousing this schit
Quote
Seriously, do you hear yourself?  Was it really necessary to walk down that street? 
is really throwing haymakers.

The few attempts at any substance were him trying to argue constitutional law with a lawyer, and clearly having a poor comprehension on what he thinks he knows. Why is it that this general he keeps bringing up is the be-all-end-all authority on military service, yet the lawyers participating in this thread have no idea about the law?

In all of the threads I have kept up with here, VV has done nothing but introduce facts and logic and is met with "Gah, ur so dumb!!!!1" or "Pffft. One day u'll lurn boy!"
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Kaos

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Re: Man Up - Repealing "Don't Ask Don't Tell "
« Reply #328 on: March 24, 2010, 02:32:18 PM »
Because responding to cold hard facts with such compelling arguments as:is really throwing haymakers.

The few attempts at any substance were him trying to argue constitutional law with a lawyer, and clearly having a poor comprehension on what he thinks he knows. Why is it that this general he keeps bringing up is the be-all-end-all authority on military service, yet the lawyers participating in this thread have no idea about the law?

In all of the threads I have kept up with here, VV has done nothing but introduce facts and logic and is met with "Gah, ur so dumb!!!!1" or "Pffft. One day u'll lurn boy!"

Absolutely unbelievable.  

Facts?  Logic?  My fucking ass.  

"Studies" (which appear to be the sum total of his alleged knowledge) are neither "fact" nor "logic."  

As for the law degree claim, I agree that theoretically this should give him a leg up.  But he's demonstrated that it really doesn't in some instances.  For the record, some of the biggest most clueless idiots I've ever met in my life are lawyers.  

Whether you want to acknowledge it or not, VV has been slapped around like Ali on Liston or Tyson on Spinks in most of these threads.  His "studies" are paper-thin.  Sure he uses a lot of words and that has apparently fooled you.  But behind all those words there is nothing but eggshell.  His "points" have been blasted out of the water time and time again.  He's twisted himself into a pretzel with his constantly shifting claims. 
« Last Edit: March 24, 2010, 02:40:58 PM by Kaos »
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GH2001

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Re: Man Up - Repealing "Don't Ask Don't Tell "
« Reply #329 on: March 24, 2010, 02:58:15 PM »
Because responding to cold hard facts with such compelling arguments as:is really throwing haymakers.

The few attempts at any substance were him trying to argue constitutional law with a lawyer, and clearly having a poor comprehension on what he thinks he knows. Why is it that this general he keeps bringing up is the be-all-end-all authority on military service, yet the lawyers participating in this thread have no idea about the law?

In all of the threads I have kept up with here, VV has done nothing but introduce facts and logic and is met with "Gah, ur so dumb!!!!1" or "Pffft. One day u'll lurn boy!"

You do know most of our Congressman who just pissed on the Constitution are lawyers right? Doesn't mean a damn thing.   All VV has done is take others' opinions (via a "study"), introduce it as "fact", and use it to back his own personal "opinion". I looked at this thread very objectively on the back and forth between him and everyone else and he has come across as looking like a smartassed know it all who likes to Google "studies" to support his own position with no give in his argument. Many of those arguments may fly in his SDS club, but they don't hold water against real world common sense.   His attitude and superiority complex I think are what many had an issue with. And to think the left likes to say the right are the dogmatic ones.. HA
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AUChizad

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Re: Man Up - Repealing "Don't Ask Don't Tell "
« Reply #330 on: March 24, 2010, 03:00:45 PM »
Sure he uses a lot of words and that has apparently fooled you.  But behind all those words there is nothing but eggshell.  His "points" have been blasted out of the water time and time again.  He's twisted himself into a pretzel with his constantly shifting claims. 
It appears you're either too dense to follow his well laid out arguments, or too stubborn to even try.
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GarMan

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Re: Man Up - Repealing "Don't Ask Don't Tell "
« Reply #331 on: March 24, 2010, 03:44:57 PM »
Because responding to cold hard facts with such compelling arguments as:is really throwing haymakers.
Yet you're conveniently silent on the condescending, know-it-all language of his posts...

The few attempts at any substance were him trying to argue constitutional law with a lawyer, and clearly having a poor comprehension on what he thinks he knows. Why is it that this general he keeps bringing up is the be-all-end-all authority on military service, yet the lawyers participating in this thread have no idea about the law?
A lawyer...   :rofl: 

You see; I didn't really play fair here.  I know the truth.  I let him bury himself on this one.  I baited him, and he took it.  He’s so intent on arguing anything and everything that he takes belligerence to a new level. 

Quote from: http://www.usconstitution.net/constnot.html#vote
The Constitution contains many phrases, clauses, and amendments detailing ways people cannot be denied the right to vote. You cannot deny the right to vote because of race or gender. Citizens of Washington DC can vote for President; 18-year-olds can vote; you can vote even if you fail to pay a poll tax. The Constitution also requires that anyone who can vote for the "most numerous branch" of their state legislature can vote for House members and Senate members.

Note that in all of this, though, the Constitution never explicitly ensures the right to vote, as it does the right to speech, for example. It does require that Representatives be chosen and Senators be elected by "the People," and who comprises "the People" has been expanded by the aforementioned amendments several times. Aside from these requirements, though, the qualifications for voters are left to the states. And as long as the qualifications do not conflict with anything in the Constitution, that right can be withheld. For example, in Texas, persons declared mentally incompetent and felons currently in prison or on probation are denied the right to vote. It is interesting to note that though the 26th Amendment requires that 18-year-olds must be able to vote, states can allow persons younger than 18 to vote, if they chose.
Quote from: http://writ.news.findlaw.com/dorf/20001213.html
A close reading of the decision in that case, Bush v. Palm Beach County Canvassing Board, reveals a clear consensus for what will strike many Americans as an outrageous proposition: there is no constitutional right to vote in a Presidential election. The fact that the state in which you reside even permits you to vote for electors is purely a matter of legislative grace.
I guess this guy, Dorf, a nationally recognized law professor from Cornell, is wrong-wrong-wrong, if I understand the genius of VV correctly.  VV knows more cuz he says so...  The final word...  The enlightened one...

In all of the threads I have kept up with here, VV has done nothing but introduce facts and logic and is met with "Gah, ur so dumb!!!!1" or "Pffft. One day u'll lurn boy!" 
FACTS:  I know...  He's mastered The Google Search function.  He researches and posts a lot of stuff. 
LOGIC:  It just seems that he has a problem applying what he Googles appropriately. 

It must be lonely looking down on the rest of us from that crystal pedestal...
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My rule of life prescribed as an absolutely sacred rite smoking cigars and also the drinking of alcohol before, after and if need be during all meals and in the intervals between them.  - Winston Churchill

Eating and sleeping are the only activities that should be allowed to interrupt a man's enjoyment of his cigar.  - Mark Twain

Nothing says "Obey Me" like a bloody head on a fence post!  - Stewie Griffin

"Every government interference in the economy consists of giving an unearned benefit, extorted by force, to some men at the expense of others."  - Ayn Rand

Kaos

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Re: Man Up - Repealing "Don't Ask Don't Tell "
« Reply #332 on: March 24, 2010, 04:15:48 PM »
It appears you're either too dense to follow his well laid out arguments, or too stubborn to even try.

His arguments are well crafted but hold nothing. 

Even the most beautiful basket can be empty. 
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GH2001

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Re: Man Up - Repealing "Don't Ask Don't Tell "
« Reply #333 on: March 24, 2010, 04:48:01 PM »
His arguments are well crafted but hold nothing. 

Even the most beautiful basket can be empty. 

Would you say its more like a chandelier in a haunted house or a house with no furniture?
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Kaos

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Re: Man Up - Repealing "Don't Ask Don't Tell "
« Reply #334 on: March 24, 2010, 05:05:32 PM »
Would you say its more like a chandelier in a haunted house or a house with no furniture?

Empty trailer. 

Maybe it's got brick underpinnings and a ramshackle wooden room tacked on the back, but at the end it's still a trailer.  And an empty one at that.  Doesn't matter how many times he calls it "the homestead" or "tha mansion"
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GarMan

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Re: Man Up - Repealing "Don't Ask Don't Tell "
« Reply #335 on: March 24, 2010, 05:34:03 PM »
Empty trailer. 

Maybe it's got brick underpinnings and a ramshackle wooden room tacked on the back, but at the end it's still a trailer.  And an empty one at that.  Doesn't matter how many times he calls it "the homestead" or "tha mansion"
Wiff da Googles at his fingatips and an above-ground pewl... 
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My rule of life prescribed as an absolutely sacred rite smoking cigars and also the drinking of alcohol before, after and if need be during all meals and in the intervals between them.  - Winston Churchill

Eating and sleeping are the only activities that should be allowed to interrupt a man's enjoyment of his cigar.  - Mark Twain

Nothing says "Obey Me" like a bloody head on a fence post!  - Stewie Griffin

"Every government interference in the economy consists of giving an unearned benefit, extorted by force, to some men at the expense of others."  - Ayn Rand

Vandy Vol

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Re: Man Up - Repealing "Don't Ask Don't Tell "
« Reply #336 on: March 27, 2010, 02:33:08 PM »
Way to go with the "quote" function!  Some people still haven't figured it out in here.  The only problem is that you forgot what initiated my little jab...

Are you fucking kidding me?  You accuse me of making some sort of argument supporting pedophiles.  In an attempt to show that you didn't, you quote a portion of your conversation that doesn't even mention the word pedophile?  Neither of us even mentioned "pedophile" in any of those quotes you cited.  How exactly does this pertain to your statement that I would support pedophiles in their journey to become teachers?

Along the way, through our little exchange, I've said that I'm no expert several times.  Rather than accept that, you challenged my positions with your own rants, points and specs of research.  I said that I was leaving the final say with the General, and you're still making this about me.  Perhaps, if you didn't rant like a know-it-all expert on everything under the sun, you'd have a little more credibility on the board.

And I'm leaving the final say with the multiple studies, opinions of military members on this board, and the military members who have advocated the repeal of DADT.  It's odd that you label me as a know-it-all when I've been citing to sources this entire thread; you're the one who refused to utilize sources for the longest time and merely spouted your vast knowledge.
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Vandy Vol

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Re: Man Up - Repealing "Don't Ask Don't Tell "
« Reply #337 on: March 27, 2010, 02:52:30 PM »
I guess this guy, Dorf, a nationally recognized law professor from Cornell, is wrong-wrong-wrong, if I understand the genius of VV correctly.

Dorf is not on the Supreme Court, and thus his interpretation of the Constitution is not authoritative.  You've heard of the Supreme Court, right?  It might help if you actually read the case as well, instead of taking Dorf's comments out of context.  The Court had this to say about the right to vote:

Harper v. Virginia Board of Elections
Quote
[T]he right to vote in federal elections is conferred by Art. I, § 2, of the Constitution (United States v. Classic, 313 U.S. 299, 314-315)

Quote
It is argued that the right to vote in state elections is implicit, particularly by reason of the First Amendment, and that it may not constitutionally be conditioned upon the payment of a tax or fee. Cf. Murdock v. Pennsylvania, 319 U.S. 105, 113.  We do not stop to canvass the relation between voting and political expression. For it is enough to say that, once the franchise is granted to the electorate, lines may not be drawn which are inconsistent with the Equal Protection Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment.

Bush v. Gore
Quote
When the state legislature vests the right to vote for President in its people, the right to vote as the legislature has prescribed is fundamental; and one source of its fundamental nature lies in the equal weight accorded to each vote and the equal dignity owed to each voter.

Quote
The right to vote is protected in more than the initial allocation of the franchise. Equal protection applies as well to the manner of its exercise. Having once granted the right to vote on equal terms, the State may not, by later arbitrary and disparate treatment, value one person's vote over that of another.

As I've said over and over, the right to vote is referenced in the Constitution; the Supreme Court even declares that the right to vote in federal elections is conferred by the Constitution explicitly.  Regardless of the fact that the right to vote in state elections is granted by states (and can be removed by states), this does not mean it is not a right.

Your statement that the right to vote doesn't exist was false, plain and simple.  Federal voting rights are conferred explicitly in the Constitution.  Furthermore, states have granted the right, and thus it exists.  Your statement that a state can remove the right to vote for a group of citizens as it sees fit was false, plain and simple.  Not only did the case law that I submitted state that, but the case to which you cite states it as well:  "Having once granted the right to vote on equal terms, the State may not, by later arbitrary and disparate treatment, value one person's vote over that of another."

You'll note that while the right emerges from the state's authority, once granted it becomes constitutionally protected by means of equal protection.  This is why there is federal oversight of the state's alterations to voting laws.  Maybe you don't agree with the judicial system's stance on the existence of a right to vote and the constitutional protections afforded to those with the right to vote, but it's been plainly stated by the Supreme Court.
« Last Edit: March 27, 2010, 03:47:56 PM by Vandy Vol »
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GarMan

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Re: Man Up - Repealing "Don't Ask Don't Tell "
« Reply #338 on: March 29, 2010, 06:27:01 PM »
Are you phuking kidding me?  You accuse me of making some sort of argument supporting pedophiles.  In an attempt to show that you didn't, you quote a portion of your conversation that doesn't even mention the word pedophile?  Neither of us even mentioned "pedophile" in any of those quotes you cited.  How exactly does this pertain to your statement that I would support pedophiles in their journey to become teachers?
You're just whining at this point.  You babbled about group protections and "legitimate purpose", so I threw it at you.  You didn't refute it.  Now, you're just whining...

And I'm leaving the final say with the multiple studies, opinions of military members on this board, and the military members who have advocated the repeal of DADT.  It's odd that you label me as a know-it-all when I've been citing to sources this entire thread; you're the one who refused to utilize sources for the longest time and merely spouted your vast knowledge.
I never refused to use sources, and...  Why waste my time?  You already know everything, anyway.  You have all the answers.  

Dorf is not on the Supreme Court, and thus his interpretation of the Constitution is not authoritative.  You've heard of the Supreme Court, right?  It might help if you actually read the case as well, instead of taking Dorf's comments out of context.  
There you go!  You have all the answers.  There's nothing I can say about anything.  It's "his interpretation is not authoritative", AND I'm "taking Dorf's comments out of context."  I'm not even going to push you on the obvious contradiction there.  (Which is it?  Both?  Really???)    

The Court had this to say about the right to vote:
blah, blah, blah...  
And, I suppose that your interpretation is FINAL.  
 :rofl:
You don't even realize how wrong you are...  as you continue this.  
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My rule of life prescribed as an absolutely sacred rite smoking cigars and also the drinking of alcohol before, after and if need be during all meals and in the intervals between them.  - Winston Churchill

Eating and sleeping are the only activities that should be allowed to interrupt a man's enjoyment of his cigar.  - Mark Twain

Nothing says "Obey Me" like a bloody head on a fence post!  - Stewie Griffin

"Every government interference in the economy consists of giving an unearned benefit, extorted by force, to some men at the expense of others."  - Ayn Rand