Kickin' it with Coach Chizik....Part II

[Godfather]

Were they built for speed or comfort?

Hotroute...Hot...route

[AuburnChopper 3.0]

No, having shitty seasons as the head coach makes you unqualified, after the fact.

Again, let's see what Chizik does with resources at Auburn.  Otherwise, this "debate" you're creating makes no sense right now.  Why?  Because as we've all agreed, ISU and Auburn are NOT the same situations, and we've all agreed, or seen anyway, that judging success by record alone would be an awfully narrow minded approach being that his ONLY stop for ONLY 2 years, was ISU.

[Godfather]

I concur, the only logical way to solve this, is a fight to the death...in the Thunderdome.

2 men enter 1 man leave

[RWS]

Thanks to Dungy and Kiffen.  The Bucs were never higher than 22nd in total offense under his watch.

Chizik was only successful at Texas because of Mack Brown, Vince Young, and Colt McCoy. See how easy that is?

[AuburnChopper 3.0]

Chizik was only successful at Texas because of Mack Brown, Vince Young, and Colt McCoy. See how easy that is?

He was pretty successful at Auburn also...  just sayin'.  His Thorpe Award winners appreciate his success as well...

[RWS]

He was pretty successful at Auburn also...  just sayin'.  His Thorpe Award winners appreciate his success as well...

Wow, he took 3 highly talented guys, and they won Thorpe awards. I guess our LB coaches will be the best LB coaches EVAR when Rolando McClain and Dont'a Hightower hit the draft.

Joe Pendry is a shoo-in for a head coaching job somewhere.....he coached Andre Smith.

Scott Loeffler should be getting a call any day now....he corched Tim Tebow.

Billy Gonzales too....he corched Percy Harvin.

[Snaggletiger]

Percy Harvey was pretty good.

[AuburnChopper 3.0]

Wow, he took 3 highly talented guys, and they won Thorpe awards. I guess our LB coaches will be the best LB coaches EVAR when Rolando McClain and Dont'a Hightower hit the draft.

Joe Pendry is a shoo-in for a head coaching job somewhere.....he coached Andre Smith.

Scott Loeffler should be getting a call any day now....he corched Tim Tebow.

Billy Gonzales too....he corched Percy Harvin.

"...annnd the whifffff!" - "Major League".

Point is, Chizik was a pretty good coach with or without the HC's, and he proved it by doing it at different locations, not just one under the wing of a single HC.  

How did Shula seperate himself from being average under those HC's you mentioned?  I honestly don't know. What's your point?  Sounds to me, or it could be argued, that the Bucs had success under Dungy and Monte Kiffen, despite a very average (and ranked below avg) offense under Mike Shula.

[RWS]

"...annnd the whifffff!" - "Major League".

Point is, Chizik was a pretty good coach with or without the HC's, and he proved it by doing it at different locations, not just one under the wing of a single HC.  

How did Shula seperate himself from being average under those HC's you mentioned?  I honestly don't know. What's your point?

My point is simply that if you coach some guys that are insanely talented, thats not necessarily reflective of your coaching. Now, it doesn't hurt your resume at all, don't get me wrong. Nobody is going to see that you coached them on your resume and frown upon it. Thats not the point I'm trying to make. When Scott Loeffler moves on and they see he coached Tim Tebow, that looks pretty good. But I think we can all agree that Loeffler wasn't pivotal to Tebow's success. Now, if Tebow was some lowley 3* recruit with maybe 3-5 offers, then there is alot to be said there.

Also, I'm a little confused about something. I didn't think Chizik coached DBs at Texas? I thought he was Co-DC/LB.....Duane Akina has coached DBs for the past 9 years at Texas. So, how exactly did Chizik coach two CBs to Thorpe awards as a LB coach?

[AuburnChopper 3.0]

My point is simply that if you coach some guys that are insanely talented, thats not necessarily reflective of your coaching. Now, it doesn't hurt your resume at all, don't get me wrong. Nobody is going to see that you coached them on your resume and frown upon it. Thats not the point I'm trying to make. When Scott Loeffler moves on and they see he coached Tim Tebow, that looks pretty good. But I think we can all agree that Loeffler wasn't pivotal to Tebow's success. Now, if Tebow was some lowley 3* recruit with maybe 3-5 offers, then there is alot to be said there.

You can equate it all to individuals and talent RWS, but the fact he was part of defenses on two different teams that went undefeated, and had great defenses. My point is is that he didn't necessarily need the guidance, or tutoring from his HC's exclusively to do his job.

In fact, it's been said that one of our defensive coaches, Thigpen, left his alma mater (UNC) on the advice from Mack Brown to coach under Chizik.  I'm not saying that this makes Chizik the best ever defensive coach on earth, but it certainly bodes to his coaching pedigree.

I never see, or never heard ANY of that from Shula.

So, again, where or how is your "comparison"...again.... valid with Shula vs. Chizik?   It's just not.  No matter how many different roads you try to bring it in from.

[AuburnChopper 3.0]

Also, I'm a little confused about something. I didn't think Chizik coached DBs at Texas? I thought he was Co-DC/LB.....Duane Akina has coached DBs for the past 9 years at Texas. So, how exactly did Chizik coach two CBs to Thorpe awards as a LB coach?

He was involved, and if you had a question about this, you could of asked Carlos Rogers when he made it a point to come to Chizik's introduction as HC in Auburn.   The Texas DB... Well, let's just call it an incredible coincidence then.  Regardless, his defenses were tops.

[RWS]

You can equate it all to individuals and talent RWS, but the fact he was part of defenses on two different teams that went undefeated, and had great defenses, my point, is that he didn't necessarily need the guidance, or tutoring from his HC's exclusively to do his job.

In fact, it's been said that one of our defensive coaches, Thigpen, left his alma mater (UNC) on the advice from Mack Brown to coach under Chizik.  I'm not saying that this makes Chizik the best ever defensive coach on earth, but it certainly bodes to his coaching pedigree.

I never see, or never heard ANY of that from Shula.

So, again, where or how is your "comparison"...again.... valid with Shula vs. Chizik?   It's just not.  No matter how many different roads you try to bring it in from.

Still not trying to compare Chizik vs. Shula on a coaching basis only. I was only comparing their situations, no matter how many times you say otherwise. As I have already said, it has still yet to be seen whether Chizik will squander his opportunity at AU. He hasn't played a game yet, so you can't fairly say whether he has or not. Everybody has their opinion whether he will or not. But in reality, we're going to have to see something on the field either way. You brought up the point about the Thorpe award winners. I'm simply telling you that if you have an insanely talented person to begin with, it shouldn't be that hard to get some hardware in their hands.

[AuburnChopper 3.0]

Still not trying to compare Chizik vs. Shula on a coaching basis only. I was only comparing their situations, no matter how many times you say otherwise. As I have already said, it has still yet to be seen whether Chizik will squander his opportunity at AU. He hasn't played a game yet, so you can't fairly say whether he has or not. Everybody has their opinion whether he will or not. But in reality, we're going to have to see something on the field either way. You brought up the point about the Thorpe award winners. I'm simply telling you that if you have an insanely talented person to begin with, it shouldn't be that hard to get some hardware in their hands.

Stop.  The fact Shula is IN this discussion is the problem.  Situations, or coach vs. coach.  It doesn't apply to the discussion.  PERIOD.

[RWS]

He was involved, and if you had a question about this, you could of asked Carlos Rogers when he made it a point to come to Chizik's introduction as HC in Auburn.   The Texas DB... Well, let's just call it an incredible coincidence then.  Regardless, his defenses were tops.

Chizik was a DB coach and DC at AU. I don't see why I should ask Carlos Rogers about Chizik coaching DBs at Texas. I know he coached Rogers at AU, no question about that.

Simple question; since Chizik was Co-DC and LB coach at Texas, and Texas has had the same DB coach the past 9 years, how did Chizik coach two Thorpe winners at Texas?

[RWS]

Stop.  The fact Shula is IN this discussion is the problem.  Situations, or coach vs. coach.  It doesn't apply to the discussion.  PERIOD.

It does, actually. The only thing to it is, as you have pointed out, we're still a few years away from knowing anything on Chizik. I agree with that, no problem. They both had experience as assistants, Shula in the NFL for 15 years for that matter. They both landed gigs in the SEC as head coaches. Shula tanked. Verdict is still out on Chizik.

[AuburnChopper 3.0]

Chizik was a DB coach and DC at AU. I don't see why I should ask Carlos Rogers about Chizik coaching DBs at Texas.

Simple question; since Chizik was Co-DC and LB coach at Texas, and Texas has had the same DB coach the past 9 years, how did Chizik coach two Thorpe winners at Texas?

Regardless of this answer RWS, your insertion of Shula into this discussion was baseless.  It's not worth further discussion.  

Anyway, google Aaron Ross, Michael Huff and Carlos Rogers Thorpe Award winners and see where the credit is given.  

[RWS]

Regardless of this answer RWS, your insertion of Shula into this discussion was baseless.  It's not worth further discussion. 

Anyway, google Aaron Ross, Michael Huff and Carlos Rogers Thorpe Award winners and see where the credit is given. 

Technically, I haven't seen in their profiles or anything where it says Gene Chizik coached them. I see in Chizik's profile that he did. My question is W H Y? Carlos Rogers, not an issue. But at Texas, how does a LB coach get credit for coaching two Thorpe Award winners when Texas has had the same DB coach for 9 years? Doesn't that seem a little odd to you?

Look up Duane Akina, 9th year Texas DB coach's Wikipedia page and tell me who coached those two Thorpe Award winners at Texas.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duane_Akina

How about this profile?
http://www.mackbrown-texasfootball.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/akina_duane00.html

[AuburnChopper 3.0]

Technically, I haven't seen in their profiles or anything where it says Gene Chizik coached them. I see in Chizik's profile that he did. My question is W H Y? Carlos Rogers, not an issue. But at Texas, how does a LB coach get credit for coaching two Thorpe Award winners when Texas has had the same DB coach for 9 years? Doesn't that seem a little odd to you?

Look up Duane Akina, 9th year Texas DB coach's Wikipedia page and tell me who coached those two Thorpe Award winners at Texas.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duane_Akina

I don't know... don't care.  It's moot as far as this topic.  Let us know if you find out anything.

[Kaos]

Fuck this...

Common ground :

1) Auburn is not Ames. Stupid point but all agree.

2) Chizik did not have the talent at Ames he should at Auburn.

3) Auburn plays a significantly tougher schedule than Iowa State.

4) Whatever Chizik did at Iowa State did not work. The team had it's two worst consecutive seasons in a decade. The blueprint failed.

5) Some argue that Chizik established himself as a failure for his inability to a least maintain the moderate level of consistent success attained under its previous coach

6) Others argue that no one can win at ISU so his performance there is irrelevant.

I laugh at #6.  My point is, was and will ALWAYS be that a program of our stature should not be casting around on refuse heaps and hiring people to run a multi million enterprise on a hunch and a handful of hope.

Regardless of how chizik performs the hire will always be retarded.

Good players make decent coaches good. Great coaches make decent players better. Show me one single solitary area where Chizik left ISU better than he found it.

I hope he learned from that debacle and will be a better coach as a result. But his "I have ne'er failed" and "blueprint" comments do not inspire confidence.  

[RWS]

I don't know... don't care.  It's moot as far as this topic.  Let us know if you find out anything.

You're the one that made the point about all the Thorpe Award winners he has coached, further proving his pedigree. But the fact that he probably didn't actually coach two of them, has nothing to do with anything? Gotcha.