Gay - Choice or Genetic?

wesfau2 · « **on:** June 05, 2009, 10:54:01 AM »

Just to fire up this old nugget in a lull:

Gay penguin couple raises a chick.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/8081829.stm

Surely this abomination is unnatural and worthy of god's righteous fury.

Tiger Wench · « **Reply #1 on:** June 05, 2009, 11:09:09 AM »

I say for gay men and a rare handful of lesbians, it is genetic. Hardwired. Obvious from a VERY early age - and no child would be able to control their natural impulses -they are what they are.

I doubt any man would deliberately CHOOSE that lifestyle. It's different for women - the emotional issues factor more into it for women than for men. Different needs kind of thing.

But I know many women who made a conscious decision to become a lesbian after abusive relationships of one kind or another with men. They made a choice. No hardwire issues there. I will go so far as to admit that in those very dark days right after my divorce, and a couple of emotionally abusive situations and a string of disastrous blind dates, I considered it briefly - not for the sex angle, but to just have a companion that I could relate to on an emotional level. More like a "BFF" than a "girlfriend"... and if the sex thing was the price to pay, well, fine. But it never came to that, because I literally met Carl three weeks later and the rest is history. Good thing too, because I had no IDEA how to start being a lesbian. Wear a sign? Put an ad in the local GLBT newspaper? Start wearing flannel shirts? Move to wherever it is in south Alabama that is full of lesbians and throw a housewarming party? No. Clue.

And see - no matter HOW bad your relationship lives got, no matter how bad your heart got broken and your mind was swirling, I think it would be a safe bet that NONE of you guys would have ever even come close to thinking about it like I did. Having a guy to hang with all the time, and if he liked a little rear door action every now and again, well, that's the price you pay for love... yeah, RIGHT.

Godfather · « **Reply #2 on:** June 05, 2009, 01:11:33 PM »

Quote from: Tiger Wench on June 05, 2009, 11:09:09 AM

I will go so far as to admit that in those very dark days right after my divorce, and a couple of emotionally abusive situations and a string of disastrous blind dates, I considered it briefly - not for the sex angle, but to just have a companion that I could relate to on an emotional level. More like a "BFF" than a "girlfriend"... and if the sex thing was the price to pay, well, fine. But it never came to that, because I literally met Carl three weeks later and the rest is history. Good thing too, because I had no IDEA how to start being a lesbian. Wear a sign? Put an ad in the local GLBT newspaper? Start wearing flannel shirts? Move to wherever it is in south Alabama that is full of lesbians and throw a housewarming party? No. Clue.

You will always have Mr. Veinzy.

Tiger Wench · « **Reply #3 on:** June 05, 2009, 01:49:53 PM »

Quote from: Godfather on June 05, 2009, 01:11:33 PM

You will always have Mr. Veinzy.

Ok... what?

If you are referring to my battery operated friend, I go for smooth, multi-speed, in designer colors. Nothing realistic looking - ick.

Ogre · « **Reply #4 on:** June 05, 2009, 02:27:19 PM »

I am of the opinion that it is genetic. I have a friend who came out our Senior year of college, and I made it my mission to try and better understand the mindset of a homosexual. I asked him very pointed questions (as Thrilla can attest), and after many discussions, he convinced me that it was genetic.

I also have a good friend who just finished his last year of seminary. We have had this discussion many times as well. Of course he believes it is a choice, because he doesn't see how anyone made in God's likeness (like each of us are supposed to be made) would be have his or her wires crossed and be attracted to someone of the same gender.

My question to him was: So tell me, when did you decide to become straight?

Blank stare.

Godfather · « **Reply #5 on:** June 05, 2009, 02:30:54 PM »

Quote from: Ogre on June 05, 2009, 02:27:19 PM

I am of the opinion that it is genetic. I have a friend who came out our Senior year of college, and I made it my mission to try and better understand the mindset of a homosexual. I screwed him 3 times in the ass(as Thrilla can attest), he decided that after the second time he was indeed gay. I also asked him very pointed questions , after many discussions and a blowjob, he convinced me that it was genetic.

FTFY

Tarheel · « **Reply #6 on:** June 05, 2009, 03:27:06 PM »

Quote from: wesfau2 on June 05, 2009, 10:54:01 AM

...
Surely this abomination is unnatural and worthy of god's righteous fury.

You might need to setup a religious forum for this discussion.

Tiger Wench · « **Reply #7 on:** June 05, 2009, 05:49:50 PM »

Quote from: Ogre on June 05, 2009, 02:27:19 PM

Of course he believes it is a choice, because he doesn't see how anyone made in God's likeness (like each of us are supposed to be made) would be have his or her wires crossed and be attracted to someone of the same gender.

Does he also believe God has Downs Syndrome, bipolar disorder, schitzophrenia, Tay-Sachs disease or any other genetic abnormality?

Kaos · « **Reply #8 on:** June 05, 2009, 10:30:54 PM »

Quote from: Tiger Wench on June 05, 2009, 05:49:50 PM

Does he also believe God has Downs Syndrome, bipolar disorder, schitzophrenia, Tay-Sachs disease or any other genetic abnormality?

And now we get to the gist of it.

Are you saying being a fag is an abnormality? That it can be reversed or minimized with drugs or treatment? Because if that's so, you're invalidating 90% of the gay agenda.

You can't choose to be schizo. It happens and you do whatever you can to manage it. You certainly don't hold rallies and demand equal schizo rights. No, you try to cure it. If it IS genetic, shouldn't attempts be made to cure queerness?

No matter what urges you feel, you can opt not to suck a dick. You can simply choose NOT to put a dick in your mouth.

It's pretty simple. We all have abnormal urges. We all also have the free will to choose to follow those urges or reject them. I would like to kill people. Seriously. I'd like to put a big 50 cal machine gun on the back of a truck and ride through the mall blasting people left and right. Some I'd prefer to do a little more personal job on and shoot them directly in the face.

But I don't kill people. I take that urge and bury it when it comes up -- like it did last week in Bel Air Mall in Mobile when I saw that 50-cent wannabe fucker with his tank-tshirt tucked into his silky tight boxers and his jeans so fucking low that his damn dick was flopping around in front. If I'd been carrying a weapon I'd have unloaded into his doo-rag and then emptied the clip on his crotch. Well, except for the one shot I'd save to cap the stupid whore bitch who was with him.

Tiger Wench · « **Reply #9 on:** June 06, 2009, 01:18:07 AM »

Quote from: Kaos on June 05, 2009, 10:30:54 PM

Are you saying being a fag is an abnormality? That it can be reversed or minimized with drugs or treatment? Because if that's so, you're invalidating 90% of the gay agenda.

No - I am saying that there are genetic differences that cannot be controlled by drugs or treatment. (OK, maybe being a skitzo was a bad choice of examples) There is no cure for Downs and no treatment. My point is that people are born different every day. If we are using the hetero model as a basis for comparison - and we pretty much have to, since a hetero majority is the only thing that has kept our species from dying out - then people born with a genetic disposition to be attracted to the same sex are genetically different from the majority. Again, why would a man choose to suck a dick if he were not hardwired that way? (and I continue to leave women out of this for the reasons I stated earlier)

Jumbo · « **Reply #10 on:** June 06, 2009, 07:18:09 AM »

Genetic.

Kaos · « **Reply #11 on:** June 06, 2009, 07:50:44 AM »

Quote from: Tiger Wench on June 06, 2009, 01:18:07 AM

No - I am saying that there are genetic differences that cannot be controlled by drugs or treatment. (OK, maybe being a skitzo was a bad choice of examples) There is no cure for Downs and no treatment. My point is that people are born different every day. If we are using the hetero model as a basis for comparison - and we pretty much have to, since a hetero majority is the only thing that has kept our species from dying out - then people born with a genetic disposition to be attracted to the same sex are genetically different from the majority. Again, why would a man choose to suck a dick if he were not hardwired that way? (and I continue to leave women out of this for the reasons I stated earlier)

Do we accept Down's Syndrome and demand that Down's sufferers be granted special treatment? Do they hold Down's Rights parades? Do we declare that it's cool to have Down's? Do we just accept it as normal?

NO! People spend kamillions of research dollars trying to find the cause so the condition can be eliminated.

If being a fag is a genetic predisposition, then shouldn't we be spending the same to find a cure instead of making TV shows about how super cool fags really are?

Again I state with conviction: We are ALL born with abnormal urges. The things I think about and don't act on are abslutely heinous. But we are supposed to control those urges, not give in to them. Fags may be born with an inclination to want dicks stuck up their asses, but like anybody else, they're supposed to control that abnormal urge.

Townhallsavoy · « **Reply #12 on:** June 06, 2009, 06:22:04 PM »

Quote from: Kaos on June 06, 2009, 07:50:44 AM

Do we accept Down's Syndrome and demand that Down's sufferers be granted special treatment? Do they hold Down's Rights parades? Do we declare that it's cool to have Down's? Do we just accept it as normal?

NO! People spend kamillions of research dollars trying to find the cause so the condition can be eliminated.

If being a fag is a genetic predisposition, then shouldn't we be spending the same to find a cure instead of making TV shows about how super cool fags really are?

Again I state with conviction: We are ALL born with abnormal urges. The things I think about and don't act on are abslutely heinous. But we are supposed to control those urges, not give in to them. Fags may be born with an inclination to want dicks stuck up their asses, but like anybody else, they're supposed to control that abnormal urge.

Agreed on all accounts.

It's simply illogical to be a homosexual. Our bodies aren't genetically structured to allow sexual preference. Sex, no matter what emotions humans have decided to involve over their evolutionary process, is the method for reproduction. You cannot physically or naturally reproduce as a homosexual.

So in conclusion, if the answer is in our genes, then a cure should be found. If the answer is in our choices, then gay people are morons.

I guess that makes me a bigot when it comes to homosexuality.

boartitz · « **Reply #13 on:** June 07, 2009, 11:06:00 AM »

#1Bammer knows that he is not queer. He sucked a dick one time and didn't like it.

Tiger Wench · « **Reply #14 on:** June 07, 2009, 02:28:40 PM »

I still disagree. We do have to make special accommodations for people with Downs - in schools and through the Americans With Disabilities Act, for example. People with Downs used to be institutionalized or hidden away - now depending on the degree of their disability, there is little to stop them from being productive members of society.

They already know what causes Downs - an abnormality in a specific gene - and any research that is going on is being done to determine how to correct the specific genetic problem prior to conception. There is one specific gene responsible for Downs. I would imagine that being gay involves a whole host of genetic markers, and a "cure" or treatment is really not an option.

I would also submit that the urges you admit to repressing are controlled by law, because they are criminal actions. You have no choice but to either supress them or go to jail. Being gay is not a criminal action, nor should it be. No one gets hurt if there are relations between two consenting adults - gay or straight. If there is a part of a gay man's brain that sees another man as attractive, then so be it.

If you accept the argument that hetero is the norm because it is required to ensure the survival of the species, then why is it a stretch to say that being gay is simply a deviation from the norm that is the result of a difference in genetics or brain chemistry or whatever... ?? I just don't see how it could be a choice.

AUChizad · « **Reply #15 on:** June 07, 2009, 03:53:41 PM »

Quote from: Tiger Wench on June 07, 2009, 02:28:40 PM

I still disagree. We do have to make special accommodations for people with Downs - in schools and through the Americans With Disabilities Act, for example. People with Downs used to be institutionalized or hidden away - now depending on the degree of their disability, there is little to stop them from being productive members of society.

They already know what causes Downs - an abnormality in a specific gene - and any research that is going on is being done to determine how to correct the specific genetic problem prior to conception. There is one specific gene responsible for Downs. I would imagine that being gay involves a whole host of genetic markers, and a "cure" or treatment is really not an option.

I would also submit that the urges you admit to repressing are controlled by law, because they are criminal actions. You have no choice but to either supress them or go to jail. Being gay is not a criminal action, nor should it be. No one gets hurt if there are relations between two consenting adults - gay or straight. If there is a part of a gay man's brain that sees another man as attractive, then so be it.

If you accept the argument that hetero is the norm because it is required to ensure the survival of the species, then why is it a stretch to say that being gay is simply a deviation from the norm that is the result of a difference in genetics or brain chemistry or whatever... ?? I just don't see how it could be a choice.

This is basically the gist of it.

Do you like sucking on a pair of tits? What about blowjobs from women? It's certainly not how God intended us to procreate. But I'll be damned if it doesn't feel good. Sex doesn't have to be logical. I'll bet half of you fuckers have weird assed fetishes you'd never own up to to anyone. It's not my place to give a shit about what makes you get your rocks off, as long as you're not breaking any laws and your partners are consenting adults.

I believe that it is genetic, and I believe it probably could be researched enough to be corrected, if someone wanted to have this done. But homosexuals don't see themselves as victims, so who would benefit from this type or procedure? You, so you don't have to be burdened by the fact that there are people out there that are into different kinky shit than you are?

Tiger Wench · « **Reply #16 on:** June 07, 2009, 07:55:09 PM »

Quote from: AUChizad on June 07, 2009, 03:53:41 PM

This is basically the gist of it.

Do you like sucking on a pair of tits? What about blowjobs from women? It's certainly not how God intended us to procreate. But I'll be damned if it doesn't feel good. Sex doesn't have to be logical. I'll bet half of you fuckers have weird assed fetishes you'd never own up to to anyone. It's not my place to give a shit about what makes you get your rocks off, as long as you're not breaking any laws and your partners are consenting adults.

I believe that it is genetic, and I believe it probably could be researched enough to be corrected, if someone wanted to have this done. But homosexuals don't see themselves as victims, so who would benefit from this type or procedure? You, so you don't have to be burdened by the fact that there are people out there that are into different kinky shit than you are?

Well said, Chadley.

wesfau2 · « **Reply #17 on:** June 08, 2009, 10:36:17 AM »

Quote from: AUChizad on June 07, 2009, 03:53:41 PM

This is basically the gist of it.

Do you like sucking on a pair of tits? What about blowjobs from women? It's certainly not how God intended us to procreate. But I'll be damned if it doesn't feel good. Sex doesn't have to be logical. I'll bet half of you fuckers have weird assed fetishes you'd never own up to to anyone. It's not my place to give a shit about what makes you get your rocks off, as long as you're not breaking any laws and your partners are consenting adults.

I believe that it is genetic, and I believe it probably could be researched enough to be corrected, if someone wanted to have this done. But homosexuals don't see themselves as victims, so who would benefit from this type or procedure? You, so you don't have to be burdened by the fact that there are people out there that are into different kinky shit than you are?

Bravo, sir.

Saniflush · « **Reply #18 on:** June 08, 2009, 10:38:21 AM »

Quote from: AUChizad on June 07, 2009, 03:53:41 PM

there are people out there that are into different kinky shit than you are?

There are?

Snaggletiger · « **Reply #19 on:** June 08, 2009, 02:26:03 PM »

Quote from: Saniflush on June 08, 2009, 10:38:21 AM

There are?

No, he was just trying to make you feel better.

I have no answers myself and personally, have no problem with someone being gay, whether it was by choice or they were genetically predisposed to being that way. All kidding aside, I've had a couple of close friends who turned out to be gay. Unlike Brad, I never questioned them about it but I found out about one after I'd been off to college. I get back and find out, Jack's gay!!! Noooo....we used to run the babes in high school. He was the starting guard on the basketball team. Jack???? Noooo!!!

The next time I saw Jack was actually while playing basketball one afternoon. I hadn't talked to the guy in several years and I was scared to death the guy was gonna' come floating over to me and start talking like Michael Waltrip. He didn't. I talked to him for about an hour afterwards and he was pretty much the same old Jack I remember. I guess he just liked the cock more.

I have no idea if this guy chose it or had had suppressed these feelings all his life. I really didn't give a shit. He wasn't coming on to me and I still considered him my friend.