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The Death of America

Kaos

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The Death of America
« on: November 06, 2023, 10:50:42 AM »
I had occasion yesterday to be back in a small town, one that I was very familiar with growing up and a place that holds some not-so-small sentimentality for me. 

One of the features of the town was a large quasi-mansion that once served as the go-to meeting place for home-cooked meals. Converted to a restaurant, the old three-story home contained four large dining rooms on the ground floor, a suite of rarely-used bed and breakfast type rooms on the second, and storage on the third.  It served breakfast and lunch every day but Saturday and evening meals Thursday - Sunday.  The evening meals were buffet style with southern delicacies like squash casserole, sweet potatoes, frog legs, quail, snap peas with jowl, turnip greens, cabbage,... or you could order steaks (perfectly seasoned) and more from the menu. 

When i went back yesterday, that place was abandoned. For sale. The porch rockers where I once waited on a table to open or where I rested after a fulfilling meal were still there, so I parked in one, rocked and watched the street for about an hour. 

From the porch, you could see into a once-thriving downtown where pharmacies, clothing stores, hardware stores, banks, five-and-dimes, restaurants, jewelry stores, dry cleaners, the theater, and more once stood. Yesterday all I saw was broken glass, crumbling facades, boarded windows, empty shells.

The entire time I sat there, I didn't see a single person.  Only one car cruised slowly past.  After about 45 minutes, an ancient stray dog came angling out from behind the abandoned grocery store and loped across the street before disappearing into a vine-choked drainage ditch.  It was like a zombie apocalypse had happened, or worse.

Got into my truck and out of curiosity, drove to what used to be the economic engines of the community.  Auto parts plant?  Closed and padlocked. Lumber mills. Closed. Textile mills. Abandoned. Enormous plant that once made lighting fixtures?  Empty, doors kicked in, windows broken. 

What happened to this town, that about 30 years ago was thriving? 

Two words:  Bill Clinton.  One word: NAFTA. 

Those plants and factories had provided employment for multiple generations of families who called that small town home. With the advent of NAFTA, they packed up and went to Mexico, leaving the workers and their children stranded. The kids had to leave. 

In retrospect, I can now see it was purposeful. The strength of this country lay in its working class, small town, church-going citizens. To break America, the globalists had to break the small towns. Force families to give up that traditional upbringing where parents could control what their kids were taught, what they saw, who they associated with. Where they could raise their kids in the way they had been raised, applying the social codes and sense of morality they had learned from their own parents. 

NAFTA has done its job. Drive through Alabama. Drive through any state.  Take note of the hundreds and thousands of small towns that are boarded up and decaying, very little left.  These were proud towns, with a strong sense of community.  And now, they're dead - or on their last legs. 

The decline has accelerated in recent years, but make no mistake. The globalists, the communists, are playing a long game - a game going back a hundred years or more.  And they are winning. 

NAFTA was the single worst policy ever enacted.  When history is re-written a hundred years from now, it should be recognized as the killing blow for the US.  More than anything before or after, it shredded the fabric of the American family and destroyed the sense of community that was once America's greatest strength.   
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GH2001

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Re: The Death of America
« Reply #1 on: November 06, 2023, 12:28:40 PM »
Ross Perot predicted you would hear a giant sucking sound if it was fully implemented - the sound of jobs being sucked or drained into Mexico from the US. And he was right, even though left wing economists and the NYT will try to tout our net job growth between 95-2000 as to why he was wrong. But he wasn't. Yes we had net job growth in the decade after....but they were either govt jobs or low wage jobs. They were not jobs where we produced things, were skilled or had decent wages.

Everything has been cheapened down. Sure we like 199 Smart TVs but what's been the cost to our society as a whole? A lot. Americans have been trained to want super cheap goods while at the same time having super high wages and jobs available. That paradigm will never reconcile. Because to have the former, all manufacturing has to take place in 3rd world countries. Although I am of the belief that goods CAN be manufactured here using lean practices and sold at a decent cost. Decent being the keyword....not rock bottom cheap. But it's way easier just to let poor countries build the crap, so that's what most of these corporate leaders opt for. Problem is this mentally bleeds out to Main Street and small town America with thriving small business that K speaks of.

The country has been sold out. It's a race to the bottom on quality and cost. It's a race to the bottom on lifestyle and economic health. Everyone wants wealth but most who don't have a degree of comfort in that area also do not want to grind for it, contrary to what any bleed hearts here say. I see this with my own two eyes daily. People have been conditioned to be lazy, entitled, weak and dependent. You can call it broadbrushing but I see it oh so often - it's all over the place. This should be apolitical and logical but it always gets flipped sideways into an empathetic debate. Or ends up commanding a reply along the lines of "ok, boomer" or "tell us more gramps" because there is no logical retort.

And it's not some anti-trade Mercantilist, nationalist rant - it's a true concern. The economy works best when it is diversified at all levels - not just SUPER HIGH earner, SUPER LOW earners and most of it being service based. We also need those others sectors, and that's what has left.

Rome - I think were there if something drastic doesn't happen. And it's sad because we have ultimately as consumers been the ones that have demanded this situation not even knowing it. Economically speaking anyway. Socially speaking is a whole other issue.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2023, 12:42:10 PM by GH2001 »
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WiregrassTiger

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Re: The Death of America
« Reply #2 on: November 06, 2023, 01:23:52 PM »
 All of the above is valid. Both posts. But I don’t think we should only blame Slick Willie. He had a Republican majority in both house and senate that could have fought. And Bush was a supporter, the best I remember. Regardless, there was definitely uniparty/establishment support.

But, man we sure had cheap jeans for a while there.

And the ultra wealthy still have their cheap labor as the democrats tell us that America first is xenophobic and a wall is racist.
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The Six

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Re: The Death of America
« Reply #3 on: November 06, 2023, 02:31:30 PM »
The South Park guys (of all people) nailed this recently with the Panderverse episode. It's the b-plot of the show, but can best be summed it with the following statement that's repeated throughout: "nobody knows how to do shit anymore"
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Re: The Death of America
« Reply #4 on: November 06, 2023, 02:55:10 PM »
The South Park guys (of all people) nailed this recently with the Panderverse episode. It's the b-plot of the show, but can best be summed it with the following statement that's repeated throughout: "nobody knows how to do shit anymore"

I fuggin’ love South Park. They have such a gift at pointing out societal lunacies and making you pee your britches with laughter at the same time.

Cartman being transgender only by throwing a pink bow on to justify shitting in the girls bathroom, Mr./Mrs. Garrison portrayed accurately as someone with mental illness.. “I’m not a fag, I’m a woman!”
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GH2001

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Re: The Death of America
« Reply #5 on: November 06, 2023, 04:09:24 PM »
All of the above is valid. Both posts. But I don’t think we should only blame Slick Willie. He had a Republican majority in both house and senate that could have fought. And Bush was a supporter, the best I remember. Regardless, there was definitely uniparty/establishment support.

But, man we sure had cheap jeans for a while there.

And the ultra wealthy still have their cheap labor as the democrats tell us that America first is xenophobic and a wall is racist.

No argument there. It was extremely bipartisan. So was the opposition to it. It's just good vs bad. Biut Bill ultimately pushed it as part of his agenda. In fairness so did Reagan and HW but what became NAFTA was far more of a lopsided trade agreement than anything Reagan ever had in mind.

Free trade won't always be even and "fair trade" but it needs to be close.Trade deficits are not healthy, NAFTA and later on the trade agreements with China in the late 90's were a death knell for American production and manufacturing.
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WiregrassTiger

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Re: The Death of America
« Reply #6 on: November 07, 2023, 01:36:11 PM »
No argument there. It was extremely bipartisan. So was the opposition to it. It's just good vs bad. Biut Bill ultimately pushed it as part of his agenda. In fairness so did Reagan and HW but what became NAFTA was far more of a lopsided trade agreement than anything Reagan ever had in mind.

Free trade won't always be even and "fair trade" but it needs to be close.Trade deficits are not healthy, NAFTA and later on the trade agreements with China in the late 90's were a death knell for American production and manufacturing.
I realize that I am not an expert in the area. And I admit to supporting Perot. Looking back, it was a mistake from the standpoint of helping Slick Willie win.

At the same time, I was voting my conscience. Perot was the only way to not go toward NAFTA and GATT.

GH you seem to be the most well informed on the issue. Would you say that Trump’s trade views are more in line with Perot than any candidate since Perot?

That’s been my  conclusion.
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GH2001

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Re: The Death of America
« Reply #7 on: November 07, 2023, 05:04:09 PM »
I realize that I am not an expert in the area. And I admit to supporting Perot. Looking back, it was a mistake from the standpoint of helping Slick Willie win.

At the same time, I was voting my conscience. Perot was the only way to not go toward NAFTA and GATT.

GH you seem to be the most well informed on the issue. Would you say that Trump’s trade views are more in line with Perot than any candidate since Perot?

That’s been my  conclusion.

Perot would have been a better POTUS than either of his opponents. He also took equally from both candidates despite urban legend because of his more moderate stance on social issues and abortion. What he pulled from each side wasn't enough to sway it to either one of them, in either direction. I think he would have been good though.

There are ways to even out trade and much of that is in negotiation when the trade agreement is made. We gave too much away with NAFTA and China, and Trump's retaliation to China with extreme tariff changes and a trade war was probably ill advised even if with good intentions.
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War Damn Six

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Re: The Death of America
« Reply #8 on: November 07, 2023, 05:33:04 PM »
I am writing in Tulsi Gabbard in ‘24.  She is better than anyone the two cluster fucks trot out.
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Re: The Death of America
« Reply #9 on: November 07, 2023, 05:58:59 PM »
I am writing in Tulsi Gabbard in ‘24.  She is better than anyone the two cluster fucks trot out.

I’d love to see her nekked, too. I’d vote for her if she won the Republican primary. Write ins for independent candidates is a vote for Dems in today's world, unfortunately.
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War Damn Six

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Re: The Death of America
« Reply #10 on: November 07, 2023, 07:11:14 PM »
I’d love to see her nekked, too. I’d vote for her if she won the Republican primary. Write ins for independent candidates is a vote for Dems in today's world, unfortunately.

Please.  The Republican will carry Alabama.  We don’t live in a swing state. My vote is symbolic.  Until we go to a popular majority vote, I will write in.
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Re: The Death of America
« Reply #11 on: November 07, 2023, 07:18:57 PM »
Please.  The Republican will carry Alabama.  We don’t live in a swing state. My vote is symbolic.  Until we go to a popular majority vote, I will write in.

Red states seem to be getting bluer percentage-wise each passing election cycle. Hopefully the trend reverses. Our country needs balance to persevere the test of time.

And I thought you lived somewhere in the Upper Midwest. Not sure why.
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GH2001

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Re: The Death of America
« Reply #12 on: November 07, 2023, 07:28:54 PM »
I’d love to see her nekked, too. I’d vote for her if she won the Republican primary.

I like the way you think Snake.

I can tell for sure that you were the one X’er at my tailgate that wasn’t drinking Landshark.
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War Damn Six

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Re: The Death of America
« Reply #13 on: November 07, 2023, 07:56:03 PM »
Red states seem to be getting bluer percentage-wise each passing election cycle. Hopefully the trend reverses. Our country needs balance to persevere the test of time.

And I thought you lived somewhere in the Upper Midwest. Not sure why.
.

Over the last two and a half years, I have been in Pittsburgh and Chicagoland more than not.  Residency is always Alabama. 
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Kaos

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Re: The Death of America
« Reply #14 on: November 07, 2023, 08:00:07 PM »
Red states seem to be getting bluer percentage-wise each passing election cycle. Hopefully the trend reverses. Our country needs balance to persevere the test of time.

And I thought you lived somewhere in the Upper Midwest. Not sure why.

It's immigration.  No reversing that.  Idiots flee rising crime, rampant homelessness and inflation, cultural decay and drag their loud, obnoxious, failed ideologies where they go.  Eventually they stupidly why things are going to shit in their new locale, completely unaware its their own toxicity that causes it. 

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GH2001

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Re: The Death of America
« Reply #15 on: November 07, 2023, 08:56:46 PM »
It's immigration.  No reversing that.  Idiots flee rising crime, rampant homelessness and inflation, cultural decay and drag their loud, obnoxious, failed ideologies where they go.  Eventually they stupidly why things are going to shit in their new locale, completely unaware its their own toxicity that causes it.

It’s also the youth. As brainwashed kids become voting age. F the man. Money grows on trees. Fight the power. Social Justice for all…..bro.
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WiregrassTiger

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Re: The Death of America
« Reply #16 on: November 08, 2023, 09:01:00 AM »
And I thought you lived somewhere in the Upper Midwest. Not sure why.
I thought the same. It must be the accent.
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wesfau2

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Re: The Death of America
« Reply #17 on: November 08, 2023, 09:23:33 AM »
Money grows on trees.

I think you're maybe not listening to the youth.  The opposite of this is quite literally the source of much of their consternation. 
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Re: The Death of America
« Reply #18 on: November 08, 2023, 09:29:09 AM »
I thought the same. It must be the accent.

I remembered a Chicago reference in past conversation, I s’pose.

Did you know?

Army personnel (except WT Jr, of course) leave their accents behind when they join and adopt grunts, moans, and knife hands to point as their preferred method of communicating. There are also strangely timed “hoo-ahs”. I lived in prison Army barracks at Ft. Bragg for a spell, so I know these things.
« Last Edit: November 08, 2023, 09:39:56 AM by Snakebite »
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WiregrassTiger

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Re: The Death of America
« Reply #19 on: November 08, 2023, 09:49:46 AM »
I remembered a Chicago reference in past conversation, I s’pose.

Did you know?

Army personnel (except WT Jr, of course) leave their accents behind when they join and adopt grunts, moans, and knife hands to point as their preferred method of communicating. There are also strangely timed “hoo-ahs”. I lived in prison Army barracks at Ft. Bragg for a spell, so I know these things.
I did a tour in the Boy Scouts but got kicked out for eating Brownies.

I can neither confirm nor deny the daring and covert missions behind enemy lines that I have told drunk chicks at the bar about. That never worked out very well.

I suspected you were more than chair force. You have that look of a trained killer. I know that look, my friend.
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