Here's the Republican front runner...

[AUTailgatingRules]

This is stupid.

I don't know what else to say, but if you believe this, you are stupid. Willfully ignorant is still ignorant.

ZERO proof that "this, that or the other" impacts climate change, except the hundreds of thousands of studies and scholarly journals and a vast, vast, vast majority consensus of the scientific community. But you, Kaos of TigersX.com say there's no proof, so there's no proof. Fuck's sake, do you dispute the earth is round too?

Why did they abandon the proven science of global cooling?

Why did they abandon the proven science of Global Warming?

Now I need to change my way of life, tax the shit out everyone, watch the political cronies get rich chasing green alternatives on the government dime all because we have no fucking clue which way the climate will CHANGE next.

Please find me one temperature model your exalted scientists published 20, 10 , or even 5 years ago that are even close to being accurate.  Proven science my ass

[Saniflush]

Please explain temperature fluctuations, better known as "Climate Change" that occurred prior to the industrial revolution. 

Did we burn too many candles?  too many farting cows?  Too many farting Dinosaurs?

DONE!

[Kaos]

This is stupid.

I don't know what else to say, but if you believe this, you are stupid. Willfully ignorant is still ignorant.

ZERO proof that "this, that or the other" impacts climate change, except the hundreds of thousands of studies and scholarly journals and a vast, vast, vast majority consensus of the scientific community. But you, Kaos of TigersX.com say there's no proof, so there's no proof. Fuck's sake, do you dispute the earth is round too?

HAHAHAHAA.  "Journals".  And "scientific studies". And "vast consensus". 
HAHAHAHAHAJAA. 

That's like an internal investigation at Alabama.

ALL bullshit and speculation.  We don't understand the vagaries of nature so we shall theorize as to their causes and then pat each other on the back to show how smart we are. 

Show me one single tangible verifiable change made that has impacted it in any way.  You can't.  But 20 or 30 years from now when the climate begins its inevitable shift toward cooling, these idiots will congratulate themselves. For doing nothing. 

[GH2001]

Please explain temperature fluctuations, better known as "Climate Change" that occurred prior to the industrial revolution. 

That ^^ is the big thing for me.

[GH2001]

This is stupid.

I don't know what else to say, but if you believe this, you are stupid. Willfully ignorant is still ignorant.

ZERO proof that "this, that or the other" impacts climate change, except the hundreds of thousands of studies and scholarly journals and a vast, vast, vast majority consensus of the scientific community. But you, Kaos of TigersX.com say there's no proof, so there's no proof. Fuck's sake, do you dispute the earth is round too?

I'll go to he middle of you both here. I think it's inconclusive. And when you aren't sure, you play it safe. Would be a shame to try and shut down any industry with any kind of byproduct and then come back 60 years later and go "oh shit, we messed up. We thought we knew. But we didn't." 

[Kaos]

That ^^ is the big thing for me.

Science had not been invented yet.  There were no journals.  Duh. 

This "climate change" shit is about like the studies on eggs. Eat them. No don't!  Only the white! Only the yolk.  They're bad!! They're good!  No they are bad!!   Consensus every time.  Until it changes. 

I eat eggs all the time.  They are delicious.  My cholesterol is fantastic.  I know people who refuse to eat eggs.  Their cholesterol is high (the whole cholesterol thing is a pharmacy farce too btw). 

[GH2001]

Science had not been invented yet.  There were no journals.  Duh. 

This "climate change" shit is about like the studies on eggs. Eat them. No don't!  Only the white! Only the yolk.  They're bad!! They're good!  No they are bad!!   Consensus every time.  Until it changes. 

I eat eggs all the time.  They are delicious.  My cholesterol is fantastic.  I know people who refuse to eat eggs.  Their cholesterol is high (the whole cholesterol thing is a pharmacy farce too btw).

Same with coffee. Some people drink half a cup and their heart about beats out of their chest. I can down a whole pot and my resting heart rate afterwards is 46. Again, inconclusive.

[AUChizad]

Please explain temperature fluctuations, better known as "Climate Change" that occurred prior to the industrial revolution. 

Did we burn too many candles?  too many farting cows?  Too many farting Dinosaurs?

Where to begin with this?

First of all, YOU brought up the hockey stick theory by falsely stating that it has flattened. Do you even know what it is you were referring to?



The "curve" of the hockey stick begins right around 1900. When do you think the Industrial Revolution took place? Where is the rise of overall temperature prior to the Industrial Revolution? What the fuck are you talking about? Or you still can't wrap your head around the fact that fluctuations occur in overall trends? You can't understand why there are spikes in the graph, and still understand that there WAS a linear trend until the turn of the century, when the TREND spiked upward? Again, if that was a measurement of someone's weight in pounds over the course of, say a decade, I'm sure you'd understand that that the peaks are going to happen and have nothing to do with the overall trend, and you would realize that at the end of that graph, the TREND upward in pounds would be alarming. But because you put a mental block on ANY possibility of the reality of climate change, you're choosing to be obtuse here.

Secondly, there are other things that emit carbon dioxide and methane, yes. Other factors contribute to the "hockey stick", including population booms. They are all relatively a problem. Coal consumption happens to be one of the bigger ones.

Why did they abandon the proven science of global cooling?

They didn't.

Why did they abandon the proven science of Global Warming?

They didn't.

The term changed to "climate change" as an attempt to explain to people who can't wrap their heads anything more complex than this retarded argument.

The overall warming contributes to changes in ocean currents, which causes those fluctuations you're perplexed by. Which means colder winters, warmer summers, and overall less predictability in the weather (which is not the same as the climate). I've linked to videos and articles that explain this in layman's terms, but you guys want to soak in your own ignorance and continue to make this stupid argument, thinking you're "getting one over" on those of us who understand it. If you would actually take your blinders off and attempt to understand what is happening, you would realize how ridiculous your argument actually is. I could link to more articles and videos again, but it will be a waste of all of our time.

Now I need to change my way of life, tax the shit out everyone, watch the political cronies get rich chasing green alternatives on the government dime all because we have no fucking clue which way the climate will CHANGE next.

Four times now I've had to say I'm not advocating "changing your way of life". I'm not saying cut out coal. I'm saying look into other options and advance technologically. Why is that such a bad thing? If we listened to you in the 1800s, we'd still be treating headaches with bloodletting.

Please find me one temperature model your exalted scientists published 20, 10 , or even 5 years ago that are even close to being accurate.  Proven science my ass

The "hockey stick" you pretended to know about is a model developed in 1999. More than 5 years ago. More than 10 years ago. Nearly 20 years ago.

Here are hundreds more from at least 20 years ago that link CO2 to climate change.
https://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=climate+change+model+c02&btnG=&hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C19&as_yhi=1996&as_vis=1

Heaven forbid you google and learn something.

I'm done with this topic. We've been around this same block. You're wrong. You're factually, inexplicably, scientifically wrong. This thread is about Trump. Bring it back up in one of the "global warming is a hoax!!1" threads you already started if you want to discuss further.

[Snaggletiger]

They had thermometers in 1016?

[AUTailgatingRules]

They had thermometers in 1016?

No they backwards extrapolated just like they have tried to forward extrapolate.  It's all made up bullshit.

Scientists and weathermen can't even tell you for sure what the weather is going to do next week but they want you to believe they know what it will be doing 20 years from now???

[Saniflush]

They had thermometers in 1016?

Well to be fair I think it was 1020, but you know they are always trying to sneak a year or four in you.

[AUChizad]

Oh, and I glossed over this:

Now I need to change my way of life, tax the shit out everyone, watch the political cronies get rich chasing green alternatives on the government dime all because we have no fucking clue which way the climate will CHANGE next.

This is the most hilarious part to me. How exactly do you figure political cronies are getting rich by exploring alternate technology.

I'm not one of these "THE KOCH BROTHERS CONTROL EVERYTHING" conspiracy theorists, but they, and the oil industry as a whole, are the ones who stand to profit from never switching off of oil. This should be obvious if you do about two seconds of critical thinking.

[AUChizad]

They had thermometers in 1016?

No they backwards extrapolated just like they have tried to forward extrapolate.  It's all made up bullshit.

Scientists and weathermen can't even tell you for sure what the weather is going to do next week but they want you to believe they know what it will be doing 20 years from now???

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2012/mar/07/past-climate-temperature-proxies

And for fuck's sake
FOR THE 100TH TIME CLIMATE ≠ WEATHER

[AUChizad]

I'll go to he middle of you both here. I think it's inconclusive. And when you aren't sure, you play it safe. Would be a shame to try and shut down any industry with any kind of byproduct and then come back 60 years later and go "oh shit, we messed up. We thought we knew. But we didn't."

Not saying to abandon coal or any other source of energy we are currently using.

Five times now.

[Snaggletiger]

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2012/mar/07/past-climate-temperature-proxies

And for fuck's sake
FOR THE 100TH TIME CLIMATE ≠ WEATHER

This from the article:

"Before that time not many thermometer records are available, so scientists use indirect temperature measurements, supported by anecdotal evidence recorded by diarists, and the few thermometer records that do exist. Scientists must rely solely on indirect methods to look back further than recorded human history."


Dear Diary.  Today, it was hot as balls.  I don't recall it being this damn hot last year.  Anyway, the invasion of Srivijaya is going well.  Mom's care package arrived today.  Very glad to get those "socks".

[Kaos]

Where to begin with this?

First of all, YOU brought up the hockey stick theory by falsely stating that it has flattened. Do you even know what it is you were referring to?



The "curve" of the hockey stick begins right around 1900. When do you think the Industrial Revolution took place? Where is the rise of overall temperature prior to the Industrial Revolution? What the fuck are you talking about? Or you still can't wrap your head around the fact that fluctuations occur in overall trends? You can't understand why there are spikes in the graph, and still understand that there WAS a linear trend until the turn of the century, when the TREND spiked upward? Again, if that was a measurement of someone's weight in pounds over the course of, say a decade, I'm sure you'd understand that that the peaks are going to happen and have nothing to do with the overall trend, and you would realize that at the end of that graph, the TREND upward in pounds would be alarming. But because you put a mental block on ANY possibility of the reality of climate change, you're choosing to be obtuse here.

Secondly, there are other things that emit carbon dioxide and methane, yes. Other factors contribute to the "hockey stick", including population booms. They are all relatively a problem. Coal consumption happens to be one of the bigger ones.
They didn't.
They didn't.

The term changed to "climate change" as an attempt to explain to people who can't wrap their heads anything more complex than this retarded argument.

The overall warming contributes to changes in ocean currents, which causes those fluctuations you're perplexed by. Which means colder winters, warmer summers, and overall less predictability in the weather (which is not the same as the climate). I've linked to videos and articles that explain this in layman's terms, but you guys want to soak in your own ignorance and continue to make this stupid argument, thinking you're "getting one over" on those of us who understand it. If you would actually take your blinders off and attempt to understand what is happening, you would realize how ridiculous your argument actually is. I could link to more articles and videos again, but it will be a waste of all of our time.
Four times now I've had to say I'm not advocating "changing your way of life". I'm not saying cut out coal. I'm saying look into other options and advance technologically. Why is that such a bad thing? If we listened to you in the 1800s, we'd still be treating headaches with bloodletting.
The "hockey stick" you pretended to know about is a model developed in 1999. More than 5 years ago. More than 10 years ago. Nearly 20 years ago.

Here are hundreds more from at least 20 years ago that link CO2 to climate change.
https://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=climate+change+model+c02&btnG=&hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C19&as_yhi=1996&as_vis=1

Heaven forbid you google and learn something.

I'm done with this topic. We've been around this same block. You're wrong. You're factually, inexplicably, scientifically wrong. This thread is about Trump. Bring it back up in one of the "global warming is a hoax!!1" threads you already started if you want to discuss further.

Blippity bleep bloop gorgle gluarg gleep.  Yippity yoo yah. 

Utter nonsense.  A 100 year sample is worthless.  A thousand year sample would mean little.  It's like asking three people if they like turnip greens and then publishing a paper stating that turnip greens are the world's favorite food. Science!! 

Or like taking temperature samples at 6 am, 7 am and 9 am and declaring conclusively that unless we do something drastic the earth will be completely scorched in a matter of hours.  Nevermind that it's going to go down again. You either don't know that of dismiss that because it doesn't fit your falling skies narrative. SCIENCE!!!   

You are in the wrong here.  You've fallen for the lie.  I hope I live long enough to say I told you so. But I eat eggs so either I will live a long life or they will kill me quickly.  Depends on the day. 

[Kaos]

Not saying to abandon coal or any other source of energy we are currently using.

Five times now.

Ah. But bitchery Clinton says she's shutting the coal mines down and putting miners out of work. 

Trump supports the miners and coal energy. 

Therefore by the transitive property of support you are a Trumpist. 

[GH2001]

Not saying to abandon coal or any other source of energy we are currently using.

Five times now.

But Hillary is. Barry is. Bernie is. They want it gone. And I think that's bad. Throw all them (energy sources) out there and let demand dictate it. The market will find the one with the most advantageous best/safest ratio trade off. Just like with anything else consumers buy in quantity. Cars, foods, cleaners, Etc.

That's all I'm saying. These politicians are getting lobbied hard to have these stances such as shutting down an entire industry overnight. THAT is not about Mother Earth, it's just politics. And it's dangerous.

[Kaos]

This from the article:

"Before that time not many thermometer records are available, so scientists use indirect temperature measurements, supported by anecdotal evidence recorded by diarists, and the few thermometer records that do exist. Scientists must rely solely on indirect methods to look back further than recorded human history."


Dear Diary.  Today, it was hot as balls.  I don't recall it being this damn hot last year.  Anyway, the invasion of Srivijaya is going well.  Mom's care package arrived today.  Very glad to get those "socks".

I took a diarist once.  Was glued to the commode unloading watery clintons for nearly two days. 

[AUChizad]

Ah. But bitchery Clinton says she's shutting the coal mines down and putting miners out of work. 

Trump supports the miners and coal energy. 

Therefore by the transitive property of support you are a Trumpist.

But Hillary is. Barry is. Bernie is. They want it gone. And I think that's bad. Throw all them (energy sources) out there and let demand dictate it. The market will find the one with the most advantageous best/safest ratio trade off. Just like with anything else consumers buy in quantity. Cars, foods, cleaners, Etc.

That's all I'm saying. These politicians are getting lobbied hard to have these stances such as shutting down an entire industry overnight. THAT is not about Mother Earth, it's just politics. And it's dangerous.

Ok. I'm still not. It is irrelevant to the argument I'm making. Taking that stance is not "middle ground" between what I'm saying and anything else, because IT IS WHAT I'M SAYING.

And here's the thing: Apparently, some of you are taking the ostrich defense plan and saying that if you pretend a thing is not real then everyone will just ignore it and move on, when in reality, what you have both just stated is evidence to the contrary. I know, evidence, right? Who needs it!

If you (and Trump and the GOP and whoever) can't say "Yes, man made climate change is real, and here's what I propose we do about it", and then explain your moderate conservative approach to MODERATELY move to other fuel sources, including the aforementioned fracking and nuclear energy liberals hate, you are essentially just giving them justified reason to ignore your input altogether.

Dems: "The earth is round, so I propose going west would be the quickest route to Japan from here."
GOP: "SCIENCE DON'T KNOW SHIT! EARTH'S FLAT, THERE'S NOTHING WE CAN DO! FUCK SCIENCE!"
Dems: "Ok, idiot. You stay here, I'm going to Japan.