Happy X-Mas (War Is Over)

[AUChizad]

http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/iraq/story/2011-12-15/Iraq-war/51945028/1

U.S. war in Iraq officially ends
By Tom Vanden Brook, USA TODAY

BAGHDAD – The U.S. war in Iraq — a conflict that killed more than 4,500 American troops, cost $800 billion and divided the nation — officially ended with a ceremony held under tight security.

    By Pablo Martinez Monsivais, AP

    The U.S. Forces Iraq colors are lowered before being encased during a ceremony in Baghdad on Thursday as the U.S. officially ended involvement in the war.

The U.S. Forces Iraq colors are lowered before being encased during a ceremony in Baghdad on Thursday as the U.S. officially ended involvement in the war.

"To be sure, the cost was high — in blood and treasure for the United States and also for the Iraqi people," Defense Secretary Leon Panetta called. "But those lives have not been lost in vain."

The fighting resulted, Panetta said, in a "free and sovereign Iraq."

    INTERACTIVE: Deaths of U.S. troops in Iraq

He also warned that the Iraq will be tested by terrorism and other threats. The U.S., he said, remains committed to Iraq's success.

Apache attack helicopters clattered overhead, a sign that the country remains dangerous.

"We are out looking for guys who could pose a threat," said Maj. Gen. Jeffrey Buchanan, the military's top spokesman in Iraq.

About 4,000 U.S. troops remain in Iraq, their withdrawal expected to be complete by the end of the month.

Army Gen. Martin Dempsey, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of staff, who commanded the First Ar division in 2003, said the first Gulf War and the current one have defined a generation of U.S. troops.

"We've paid a great price here, and it's a price worth paying," Dempsey said.

Thursday's ceremony commemorated the "end of mission." The flag for the U.S. military in Iraq — white with the symbol of its headquarters in the center — was wrapped and placed in a camouflage sheath by Gen. Lloyd Austin, the top commander.

Austin ordered troops to cross the border into Iraq from Kuwait in 2003, and is overseeing their complete withdrawal.

The ceremony was "an especially poignant moment for me," Austin said.

Austin acknowledged the more than 30,000 U.S. troops wounded in Iraq.

"Please know you will always have a place in our formation," Austin said.

[GH2001]

I get lambasted by a lot of my GOP friends for my stance on this, but I am glad this is over. I did not want us staying over there 1 minute longer. We will never "fix" that region. No one will. And politicians need to realize this about the middle east. Let the crazy idiots over there figure it out for themselves and kill each other in the name of Allah all they want. As long as we make sure our borders are sewed up and defended, we will be ok.

[AUTiger1]

Not to go all Ron Paul on anyone, but good, get them the fuck out.  Get them the fuck out of Afghanistan as well.  Honestly, I don't give a shit about that area of the world other than for two things.  Oil, b/c we still use a hell of a lot of it.   Nukes, I don't want them to have one.  Not that I think they would have the capability of being able to hit our shores with one, but b/c I am afraid if they get one, they will use it against someone else who has them (read:Israel) and that would be some bad, bad shit.  The chain reaction and fallout from it would be enough to get the entire world in some deep shit.   

Also share this,  there will a lot of people in this area that will be proud this is happening.  The military budget is set, then they set another one to that is strictly the war spending.   If they don't have money to cover the war they start slashing R&D programs to cover those cost.   Once they stop spending on war, the R&D programs will start to see their funding trickle in a little at a time until it is fully funded again.  That allows contractors to create jobs to support the work that is coming in.  The only catch to that is having a Congress that is dedicated to it.  If they aren't then that money will go elsewhere and it will suck.

[AUTiger1]

I get lambasted by a lot of my GOP friends for my stance on this, but I am glad this is over. I did not want us staying over there 1 minute longer. We will never "fix" that region. No one will. And politicians need to realize this about the middle east. Let the crazy idiots over there figure it out for themselves and kill each other in the name of Allah all they want. As long as we make sure our borders are sewed up and defended, we will be ok.

This part.  It has been tribal warfare since the beginning of time and they don't really care about having a democracy in place.  They care about killing the tribe in the next town over and protecting their own.  They have been killing each other forever and they always will.  Bring them home, secure our borders and build our military machine by giving our guys and gals the best technology, weapons and missiles that the world has ever seen.  That sort of goes into what I was talking about earlier.    And yes, I know that sounds just like Ron Paul.

[GH2001]

Not to go all Ron Paul on anyone, but good, get them the fuck out.  Get them the fuck out of Afghanistan as well.  Honestly, I don't give a shit about that area of the world other than for two things.  Oil, b/c we still use a hell of a lot of it.   Nukes, I don't want them to have one.  Not that I think they would have the capability of being able to hit our shores with one, but b/c I am afraid if they get one, they will use it against someone else who has them (read:Israel) and that would be some bad, bad shit.  The chain reaction and fallout from it would be enough to get the entire world in some deep shit.   

Also share this,  there will a lot of people in this area that will be proud this is happening.  The military budget is set, then they set another one to that is strictly the war spending.   If they don't have money to cover the war they start slashing R&D programs to cover those cost.   Once they stop spending on war, the R&D programs will start to see their funding trickle in a little at a time until it is fully funded again.  That allows contractors to create jobs to support the work that is coming in.  The only catch to that is having a Congress that is dedicated to it.  If they aren't then that money will go elsewhere and it will suck.

I agree. I think you are right on the oil though. If we drilled our own, we would really have no monetary or vested interest in that shithole region. Fine by me. As Ron Paul said, we have the best technology in the world. We have anti missle defense systems out the wazoo. I am not really concerned with Iraq hitting us with a scud. Their primary means of transportation in the region is still a fucking camel.

If we get our shit straight here on R&D, and be alert - we have nothing to fear.

[AUTiger1]

I agree. I think you are right on the oil though. If we drilled our own, we would really have no monetary or vested interest in that shithole region. Fine by me. As Ron Paul said, we have the best technology in the world. We have anti missle defense systems out the wazoo. I am not really concerned with Iraq hitting us with a scud. Their primary means of transportation in the region is still a fucking camel.

If we get our shit straight here on R&D, and be alert - we have nothing to fear.

Agree, we also have a shit ton of oil here that we haven't drilled.  Canada also has a shit ton of oil they haven't tapped into yet either.  The only problem is building the refineries that would be needed to handle it all.   That would take some time, but then again, that would also be some decent paying jobs here at home. 

I really think that in the next few years you are going to see more of a cyber war, than a conventional war.  A lot of money is going to be pumped into that area.  But yes, we need to get our shit in one sock with R&D.

[AUJarhead]

We will never "fix" that region. No one will.

Not until our military stops this whole rules of engagement bullshit.

You shoot at me from a church?  I'm going to level the church.  Hide in an apartment building?  I'm launching an RPG in your window.

Our military has two jobs and two jobs only.  Kill people and break things.  And we do that very well.

[djsimp]

Why Happy X-Mas?

[AUChizad]

Why Happy X-Mas?

Thought it was fitting considering we declared the war over a week before Christmas.

Not familiar with the John Lennon song? I posted the video in the OP.

[Kaos]

Couple of things. 

"War is over"?  Been over for a long, long time.  Was over when Bush said it was over.  Everything since has just been reconstruction.  Like Civil War reconstruction.  Saying it's "over" now is a dick sucking political move. 

4500 troops were killed.  Perspective please.  We need a fucking assload of it here. 

4500 is about 1/10th the number of men who died in three days at Gettysburg.
116,000 died in World War One
405,000 in WWII
6800 US soldiers (and 22,000 Japanese) died in a little over 30 days at Iwo Jima
We lost 35,000 in Korea and about 60,000 in Vietnam (still about the same as three days at Gettysburg)
Almost as many Americans died in five hours on 9/11 than in this entire war. 


In terms of lives lost, this war is about on par with Philippine–American War which lasted 15 years and started in 1898.   Ever heard of it? 

Not trivializing the death of American soldiers by any stretch of the imagination but as wars go, this is barely a blip.  From the coverage it has received, however, you'd think we've been under siege and this is the most horrific event ever witnessed by mankind. 

Let's get some more perspective:

11,000 people were killed by drunk drivers in 2008 alone.  More than twice as many as in the entire Iraq "war"
About as many people die from (allegedly) smoking per year as in the entire Iraq "war"
Obesity allegedly causes 300,000 deaths per year in the US.  That's 67 Iraq wars per year. 

Maybe I'm cynical, but all the posturing over the heavy price paid seems out of bounds to me.  And before you start in with the "each life" argument I'd like to note that one of the 4500 killed was a former student of mine, a bright kid who I liked a lot.  It hurts me to think that his wife and kids are deprived of him because of this. 

[djsimp]

Thought it was fitting considering we declared the war over a week before Christmas.

Not familiar with the John Lennon song? I posted the video in the OP.

I was being facetious.

[GH2001]

I was being facetious.

You lack hyperbole.

Asshole.