AP: Feeblist Economic Recovery Since Great Depression

[GH2001]

My hats off to both of you for saying how I feel without totally committing me to Searcy. We have a BIG mess and no one in DC is willing to fix it. It's almost as if the people don't exist save the corporations/lobbying firms who have bought and paid for our representation. It's a steep climb but it's doable. I will be voting Ron Paul if he runs , or Libertarian if he does not. Regardless, I refuse to vote republicrat.

Then you have effectively voted Democrat. Whether you like it or not.

[Tarheel]

I may come across as dumb good sir, but I assure you, that I am more well read that a lot. 
...

I gather that; hope not to have implied otherwise.

...
Btw:  We need to start a cigar thread.  I know this has nothing to do with politics, but you mostly respond in here.  Tabak Especial are the bomb.
...

Yes, we do.  Tabak Especial eh?  I'll give it a try.  I have stumbled-upon the brand Bahia in the past few months and, while being a bundled cigar, they are phenomenal.  Godfather had recommended Cain Daytona for me and I liked the corona-size so much I ended up buying a box; a little pricey but a great cigar.  Room 101 Connecticut is another one that surprised the heck out of me at the Las Vegas Big Smoke last year; I've been smoking them ever since.  (Maybe we ought to take this discussion to the another forum...)

[Tarheel]

My hats off to both of you for saying how I feel without totally committing me to Searcy. We have a BIG mess and no one in DC is willing to fix it. It's almost as if the people don't exist save the corporations/lobbying firms who have bought and paid for our representation. It's a steep climb but it's doable. I will be voting Ron Paul if he runs , or Libertarian if he does not. Regardless, I refuse to vote republicrat.

We do have a big mess; there's no doubt about that.  I may be one of the very few sane Republicans out there; I do see fundamental differences between the choices which is why I will not vote Democrat or Libertarian.

[bottomfeeder]

Why are Greece, Spain, Italy, Portugal and so many other countries experiencing depression-like conditions right now? It is because they have too much debt. Why do they have too much debt? It is because they allowed themselves to become enslaved to the bankers. Borrowing money from the bankers can allow a nation to have a higher standard of living in the short-term, but it always results in a lower standard of living in the long-term. Why is that? It is because you always have to pay back more money than you borrowed.

http://marketdailynews.com/2012/08/20/this-is-what-happens-when-you-allow-your-country-to-become-enslaved-to-the-bankers/

[GH2001]

http://marketdailynews.com/2012/08/20/this-is-what-happens-when-you-allow-your-country-to-become-enslaved-to-the-bankers/

You are almost there. And why did they borrow money? That's your rootcause. Quit looking at symptoms and blaming financial institutions.

FWIW - I'm a "banker" and you have no clue how that shit works aside from the shit you read on Alex Jones and Illuminati consipracy websites. The problem with banking only occured when the Fed Gov got involved when private banks essentially became agents of the Federal Reserve. Just like the Euro, WTO or World Bank. Gov't is your root case culprit not a bank.

[bottomfeeder]

You are almost there. And why did they borrow money? That's your rootcause. Quit looking at symptoms and blaming financial institutions.

FWIW - I'm a "banker" and you have no clue how that shit works aside from the shit you read on Alex Jones and Illuminati consipracy websites. The problem with banking only occured when the Fed Gov got involved when private banks essentially became agents of the Federal Reserve. Just like the Euro, WTO or World Bank. Gov't is your root case culprit not a bank.

We don't need a central bank and banks that loan the government their own money or banks period. I hate fucking banks who make money from nothing, just print it up. Yes, government passed the Fed Reserve act and the banking act, so yes they are the problem too. Financial institutions. along with other corporations, now own the government so we have soft fascism.

FWIW- I AM NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR PAYING GOVERNMENT DEBT.

[bottomfeeder]

Public or private debt it's all going down REAL soon. Mark my words.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/08/21/berkshire-munidebt-idUSL2E8JL4O420120821

Buffett cuts $16 billion US municipal credit bet in half

I still love the Swiss franc

[GH2001]

We don't need a central bank and banks that loan the government their own money or banks period. I hate fucking banks who make money from nothing, just print it up. Yes, government passed the Fed Reserve act and the banking act, so yes they are the problem too. Financial institutions. along with other corporations, now own the government so we have soft fascism.

FWIW- I AM NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR PAYING GOVERNMENT DEBT.

We didn't have these issues with private banks before the Fed was invented (during Xmas on a private vote off the coast of Ga). The Fed Reserve and its power are the issue, not private banks.

When a bank lends money, it is real capital they own. Their ass IS on the hook for it, although they are essentially an agent of the fed at that point (another Fed power). But yes, the money is printed and backed by nothing. It's simply a federal reserve note - why would you blame First Bank of Jacksonville for something the Fed does and something the Fed MAKES them do? Do you know how much authority the Fed and FDIC have over private banks? I agree with your premise but you are pointing the wrong direction because youve read too many articles written by people who have no clue what they are talking about in this regard (Alex Jones and the like).

If financial institutions owned the govt then why in the hell did the govt have to bail THEM out? Most of our debt is held in bonds and by the Chinese. Not by Citibank or B of A.

[bottomfeeder]

Get off of the Alex Jones references will ya? Most of the financial and economic cites I use are from credible sources. mises.org, lewrockwell.com, wsj, IBD, agora financial, Gary North, Peter Schiff, etc. Alex Jones is fringe, but sometimes he gets it right. Name one bank that has 10% reserves on outstanding loans? Just one.

Audit the fed and Ft. Knox...

And why is Soros bailing the financials and berkshire-hathaway dumping munis in favor of silver?

[GH2001]

Name one bank that has 10% reserves on outstanding loans? Just one.

Audit the fed and Ft. Knox...

And why is Soros bailing the financials and berkshire-hathaway dumping munis in favor of silver?

1. Again, a product of the system the Fed has created. The market is flooded with loans that shouldn't be there. This comes with banks being Fed and FDIC agents, along with them being FORCED to lend X amount. People (mainly the lame stream media) always leave out that part about how they were FORCED to lend. See - Community Reinvestment Act of 1979/1995 and Federal Reserve Act of 1913.

2. No issue with that at all.

3. True, they are doing this but why? Because the dollar is crap and the economy is crap. They are hedging. Commodities are always good no matter what...so....What the hell does that have to do with blaming private banks for all the world's problems since 200 AD? Besides, George Soros is a currency manipulator anyway. You should never use him as part of your economic defense platform. He's like the guy that sets fires to houses so he can sell the fire dept equipment. He manipulates anything he can get his grubby little hands on. The epitome of evil really.

[bottomfeeder]

I'm not favoring Soros or Buffet, just stating their behaviors in the market. I know those two acts you stated and it sucks. Who were the lobbyist behind those laws? Who has benefited the most from the contraction of the housing market? Who will benefit in the future will the US defaults on all of it's debt (public and private)?

I believe in real property rights and hard assets like gold and silver. All fiat currencies will fall, along with the empires that created them. (Do as the Romans do). I'm sorry you are a banker, but everyone needs a job. The Rothchilds are saying there will be issuance of a global currency within five years, but I say less than two years.

[GH2001]

I'm not favoring Soros or Buffet, just stating their behaviors in the market. I know those two acts you stated and it sucks. Who were the lobbyist behind those laws? Who has benefited the most from the contraction of the housing market? Who will benefit in the future will the US defaults on all of it's debt (public and private)?

I believe in real property rights and hard assets like gold and silver. All fiat currencies will fall, along with the empires that created them. (Do as the Romans do). I'm sorry you are a banker, but everyone needs a job. The Rothchilds are saying there will be issuance of a global currency within five years, but I say less than two years.

Currency is ok as long as it is backed and redeemable. Problem is, now it is not. Kennedy was going to change that and was promptly shot (maybe because of it?). LBJ issued an executive order to reverse Kennedy's monetary policy of making money worth something and not just a worthless Federal Reserve Note.

My point is that banks are merely a symptom of a bigger problem. You have to dig deeper to see the bigger systemic issue with our financial problem. It lies with govt creating and meddling with the system of credit and banking.

I can tell you from first hand experience that banks did not benefit from the crisis in general. Many have been closed and are under FDIC control (like mine). A bank would never make too many risky sub prime loans on purpose, knowing most would default. It just wouldn't make good financial sense. They would lose money doing that.

They were forced to make these loans (reinvestment act). Then when the market collapsed, in to the rescue comes the lovely govt - who ironically caused the issue in the first place (subprime flooding) - offering to bail out the banks with TARP but under certain conditions (paying it back plus interest and putting in tighter regulations like Dodd/Frank).

Banks were basically punished by the GOVT for doing something the GOVT made them do in the first place. Weird eh? Too bad thats not what the media feeds to the public. Again, the root cause of all of this is too much govt meddling. If you look back, it has caused more than just this too.

[bottomfeeder]

I think this quote is applicable at this point.

"Once enough of us decide we've had enough of all these so-called good things that the government is always promising – or more likely, when the country is broke and the government is unable to fulfill its promises to the people – we can start a serious discussion on the proper role for government in a free society," says Ron Paul.

[CCTAU]

They were forced to make these loans (reinvestment act). Then when the market collapsed, in to the rescue comes the lovely govt - who ironically caused the issue in the first place (subprime flooding) - offering to bail out the banks with TARP but under certain conditions (paying it back plus interest and putting in tighter regulations like Dodd/Frank).

Banks were basically punished by the GOVT for doing something the GOVT made them do in the first place. Weird eh? Too bad thats not what the media feeds to the public. Again, the root cause of all of this is too much govt meddling. If you look back, it has caused more than just this too.

People are too lazy and ignorant to learn and understand this. This was another one of our government social engineering plans gone wrong.

[GH2001]

Good article that illustrates how that law setup the "house of cards" that eventually came crumbling down. It was written back in 2008 at ground zero of the crisis.

http://voices.yahoo.com/the-community-reinvestment-act-credit-crunch-1992536.html?cat=17

Politicians and pundits have differing opinions about the cause of the credit crisis now afflicting the American economy. Everything from deregulation to "Wall Street greed" has been pointed to for blame. But the Community Reinvestment Act of 1995 may be the real culprit.
The Community Reinvestment Act of 1995, which was a revision of a similar law enacted in 1977, was a Clinton era law that purported to increase the availability of loans to low income business owners and home buyers. What the Community Reinvestment Act did to further this goal was to punish banks and other lending institutions that did not sufficiently provide credit to low income borrowers. The Community Reinvestment Act empowered community organizers, such as Barack Obama, to pressure lending institutions to loan money to people without the ability to pay it back.

The problem was that many of these borrowers did not have sufficient income or assets to qualify for a loan Hence the subprime mortgage was born, offered to borrowers without the kind of credit history or assets to qualify for a more traditional loan. Various stratagems were employed to offset some of the risk of loaning money to bad risk borrowers, including charging a higher interest rate.

This practice, encouraged by the government through the Community Reinvestment Act and related regulations, seems to have led to the house of cards that has led to the necessity for a seven hundred billion dollar bailout of financial institutions. While the banks and other lending institutions must share some of the blame for engaging in risky lending practices, these were done in an atmosphere in which political coercion trumped sound financial practice.

Unfortunately the credit crunch that was caused, at least in part, by the Community Reinvestment Act was sparked calls for more not less regulation. While the bailout is probably necessary to save the United States from economic collapse, it will not address the real problem that led to the credit crunch in the first place.

Newt Gingrich, the former Speaker of the House, has proposed a series of reforms that are worthy of at least consideration. Gingrich proposes suspending the mark to market rule that artificially forces some companies into bankruptcy, repeal the Sarbanes-Oakley Law that Gingrich believes is crippling the economy, lower the capital gains tax to zero, and enact a sensible energy policy that encourages all means of domestic energy production, including oil drilling, nuclear, and alternative sources such as wind, biofuels, and solar.

Certainly one can argue the details of a long term fix to the credit crunch. But it is clear that without a long term solution, one that relies more on the free market and not on the dead hand of government regulation, any credit bailout, no matter how artfully crafted, with just be a temporary fix.