Tigers X - Number one Source to Talk Auburn Tigers Sports
Pat Dye Field => War Damn Eagle => Topic started by: AUChizad on August 10, 2012, 07:44:49 PM
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"Oh, people have caught wind of our grade changing to qualify players?
These are not the droids you're looking for.
Auburn's doing it."
http://www.athleticscholarships.net/2012/08/10/ncaa-questions-jovon-robinson-transcripts.htm
The Major Questions in the Jovon Robinson Transcripts Debacle
Earlier today, Kyle Veazey of the Memphis Commercial Appeal broke the news that following an inquiry from the NCAA, a guidance counselor at the high school of Auburn freshman Jovon Robinson resigned after admitting to doctoring Robinson’s transcripts. While it sounds like the story is mostly over for the guidance counselor, it is just starting for the athlete, who expected to get his college career underway later this month.
Robinson’s eligibility and Auburn’s fate rests on three questions. First, how much help did the falsified transcripts give Robinson? Two, what did Robinson know about the counselor’s actions? And three, how involved was Auburn?
How Much Help Were the Transcripts?
Job one for the NCAA, specifically the NCAA Eligibility Center, is to figure out what Robinson’s real grades were and whether he would still have been a qualifier. The assumption is that if there was a fraudulent transcript, it was because he was going to be a nonqualifier. But it could be that Robinson was going to be close and the new transcript made him appear to be a qualifier by a safer margin. Or it could have been falsified to meet admissions standards at Auburn or another school.
Even if Robinson’s true grades leave him a nonqualifier, how short he is would be critical for his chances at an initial eligibility waiver. And depending on the answer to the next question, he may have quite a bit of mitigation.
What Did the Athlete Know?
It might be hard to stomach another Auburn eligibility issue resting on what an athlete knew, but it applies here. The NCAA could end up in one of three places:
• Evidence that Robinson knew or was active in falsifying his transcripts.
• Evidence that Robinson did not know.
• No evidence or inconclusive evidence either way.
The first makes sense. As for the second, it is very difficult, if not impossible, to prove you did not know something. But you can show some evidence. For instance, if Robinson asked his counselor what extra work he should do or suspected he was not going to be eligible and wanted to know what he needed to do to fix the situation. Or if the counselor had told Robinson for a long time that he would be fine.
What Did Auburn Know?
What Auburn knew should not have too much impact on Robinson’s eligibility, unless Auburn was how Robinson knew his transcripts were being falsified. Rather, what Auburn knew or did will mostly impact Auburn.
Pressuring a high school guidance counselor would be a serious charge for the university. It would be almost guaranteed to result in individuals being fired and charged with ethical conduct violations, and would likely be a major violation for Auburn as well. Simply knowing it will happen and allowing it would be almost as bad. But those violations take time to process and are secondary to determining Robinson’s eligibility as soon as possible.
So What Should the NCAA Do?
Robinson’s eligibility is a complex question because there are two issues right now: whether he would have been a qualifier and whether he knew about the guidance counselor’s actions. If Robinson had knowledge of or participated in the academic fraud, that would be an ethical conduct violation with a normal penalty of a one-year suspension and losing a season of competition. If Robinson was also going to be a nonqualifier, that would mean he would need to go the junior college route, be starting with three seasons of eligibility, and maybe need to sit out for a year when he returns to Division I.
If the NCAA does not have evidence that Robinson knew what was going on and he was going to be a qualifier anyway, nothing should happen with his eligibility. If there is no clear evidence either way and Robinson was going to be a nonqualifier, he should just be declared a nonqualifier and would have to leave Auburn unless he can get a waiver.
However if Robinson can show clear evidence he did not know what was going on and was going to be a nonqualifier, that would be strong mitigation and he likely deserves a waiver. Even if he would have been very short, he should get a partial waiver to keep his scholarship and continue practicing with the team, just not be cleared to play this year.
Finally, if Auburn was involved and Robinson was not, he should have the opportunity to leave Auburn. He should not be declared ineligible and forced to leave. Rather, he should be permitted to void his National Letter of Intent, transfer without restriction, and be immediately eligible if he decided to leave Auburn.
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*Word on da skreets*
The Guidance Counselor is a Ole Miss Alum.
Also, Ole Miss' HC Freeze wanted Jovon bad.
It's a Woodale High & possibly Jovon Robinson issue...could also be an Ole Miss issue.
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Sadly, this one has legs. JR being held out of practice and the guidance counselor losing her job makes me think JR may be done at Auburn.
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*Word on da skreets*
The Guidance Counselor is a Ole Miss Alum.
Also, Ole Miss' HC Freeze wanted Jovon bad.
It's a Woodale High & possibly Jovon Robinson issue...could also be an Ole Miss issue.
Nah, if we've learned anything from the Newton situation it's that scandals involving Mississippi schools and players that end up at Auburn, is that only Auburn is accountable. Once it's determined we're clean, everyone loses interest.
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Sadly, this one has legs. JR being held out of practice and the guidance counselor losing her job makes me think JR may be done at Auburn.
Not if Jovon didn't know about it and if the grade that was changed wouldn't have mattered as far as his eligibilty to get into Auburn.
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Not if Jovon didn't know about it and if the grade that was changed wouldn't have mattered as far as his eligibilty to get into Auburn.
I gotta ask - if it didn't matter, why would the counselor have done it? You cannot tell me that Ole Piss has higher standards than Auburn - it ain't like he was trying to get into Stanford... this is the SEC, bitch.
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You cheating, dirty sons of bitches.
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I gotta ask - if it didn't matter, why would the counselor have done it? You cannot tell me that Ole Piss has higher standards than Auburn - it ain't like he was trying to get into Stanford... this is the SEC, bitch.
While I don't know any info at all regarding the situation, if Jovon was interested in Ole Miss, the guidance counselor may have forged the transcript well before Auburn came knocking. When Auburn looked into Jovon's grades, they were already changed in hopes that he would attend Ole Miss. He then signed with Auburn.
Just putting speculative pieces together.
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Pete Thamel all over this.
http://bit.ly/S85sKt
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PNJ ain't letting go.
http://www.pnj.com/article/20120811/SPORTS/308100029/School-district-analyzing-emails-Darius-Paige-case?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|Sports
A Pensacola News Journal public records request for documentation pertaining to Washington High’s contact with several athletic organizations has been temporarily denied.
Escambia County School District Deputy Superintendent Norm Ross informed the News Journal late Thursday afternoon that electronic communications between Washington athletic director Troy Faucheaux and the NCAA, Florida High School Athletic Association, University of Alabama and Alabama High School Athletic Association were not immediately available.
“Please be advised there is an active investigation involving the information you have requested,†Ross said in an email. “Once this investigation is concluded, the information you have requested will be available ten days after the closure date. We appreciate your patience during this time.â€
War. There are casualties.
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Per Phillip Marshall, word is that Jovon will have to redshirt this year and will remain at Auburn University.
With Mason, Omac, Prosch, Grant and Blakely all older and poised for playing time, I doubt Jovon would have seen the field much this season anyway.
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It's just sad that adults continue to screw things up for high school kids. They do things that they think are helping the kids, but in the end, it just makes all parties involved look bad. What sucks even more is that in the end, it's the kid and the school that he ends up at that has to pay the price.
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It's just sad that adults continue to screw things up for high school kids. They do things that they think are helping the kids, but in the end, it just makes all parties involved look bad. What sucks even more is that in the end, it's the kid and the school that he ends up at that has to pay the price.
Your bitch Roy Adams is the one fucking with kids.
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http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/eticket/story?page=crimson
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Your bitch Roy Adams is the one fucking with kids.
He certainly hasn't done Alabama any favors over the years. He is crooked as shit himself, though.
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Jon Solomon stirring the hornets' nest.
http://www.al.com/sports/index.ssf/2012/08/jovon_robinsons_transcript_rai.html
Jovon Robinson's transcript raises more questions than answers
Published: Sunday, August 12, 2012, 5:00 AM
Jon Solomon -- The Birmingham News
BIRMINGHAM, Alabama -- Here's what we know about the Jovon Robinson transcript case.
Auburn is keeping the freshman running back out of practice while the NCAA investigates allegations that his Wooddale High School transcript was falsified. Memphis City Schools, after being contacted by the NCAA last week, said a Wooddale guidance counselor resigned after admitting to creating the fake transcript.
There's a lot we don't know -- and may not know for a while.
Did the falsified transcript, which was first reported by The Memphis Commercial-Appeal, change Robinson from an NCAA non-qualifier to a qualifier? Was Robinson aware of the fabricated document? Did anyone connected to Auburn know about the fake transcript and/or apply improper pressure to Wooddale, or was everyone at Auburn in the dark?
Jon Solomon is a columnist for The Birmingham News. Join him for live web chats on college sports on Wednesdays at 2 p.m.
The NCAA has been talking to several people in Memphis about Robinson. One person who interviewed with the NCAA last week was Lynord Crutchfield, Robinson's high school coach as a sophomore and junior.
Crutchfield said Saturday the NCAA asked questions about the transcript and other topics that weren't confined only to Robinson.
"But I really don't want to get into what else they were talking about," Crutchfield said. "They were asking a lot of different questions about a lot of different things."
Crutchfield, who now coaches at Central High School in Memphis, said he has no recollection of a false transcript for Robinson.
"The transcripts given out when I was there were his original transcripts," Crutchfield said. "The whole situation about another transcript given to Auburn was all brand new. I didn't know anything about it. All I can do is talk about when I was there, and when I was there nothing fishy was going on. If there was, I didn't know anything about it."
Robinson's mother, Tina Wordlow, told The Commercial-Appeal that everything her son got, "he got honestly, by hard work."
Said Crutchfield: "Everybody knew he had some (academic) work to do. But it wasn't a situation that was totally out of reach. When he was a junior, he had like a 2.3, 2.4 GPA and he was on course making A's and B's if he got his ACT score. It was a situation where he was close but he wasn't totally qualified."
Attempts to reach current Wooddale coach Keith Spann were unsuccessful. Wooddale Principal Michael Kyle referred all questions to Memphis City Schools, which isn't commenting any further as it investigates.
Speaking generally from my experiences covering academic-fraud cases, high school guidance counselors don't falsify athletes' transcripts on their own. Someone else is usually involved. But connecting the dots is a chore.
Five years ago, a counselor at Hoover High School made an unauthorized grade change allowing Josh Chapman to be eligible at Alabama. Hoover kept Chapman's grade because its investigation characterized the change as "innocent human error" yet it also refuted the principal's claim of a computer problem that improperly rounded up grades.
Then-Alabama defensive coordinator Kevin Steele had notified a Hoover guidance counselor that Chapman's GPA barely made him ineligible. Hoover's investigative report made a point of stressing it wasn't suggesting that Steele asked for a grade change.
When NBA player Eric Bledsoe had conflicting grades on his Parker High School transcript and a night-school grade report while taking courses out of sequence, Birmingham city schools' 2010 investigation concluded a teacher's reasons for the grade change weren't credible. But the system decided there wasn't enough evidence to retroactively change Bledsoe's grades, which made him eligible at Kentucky.
What's potentially troubling for Robinson's college eligibility is the Memphis school system acknowledges a fraudulent transcript that a guidance counselor admitted to doctoring.
That could mean Robinson will have to go to junior college, if the fake transcript got him eligible under the NCAA's minimum standards. NCAA compliance expert John Infante, author of the Bylaw Blog, wrote that Robinson could get a waiver to stay at Auburn as a non-qualifier if he shows evidence he wasn't aware of the fraud.
The victims in stories such as this are the kids. It's tragic, really. They're the ones missing out on a real education.
And for what? To acquire something tangible in return for a fake transcript? To be generous to the athlete so his lottery ticket for a brighter future isn't derailed prematurely?
Those tickets into pro sports rarely get cashed. The same can't be said for life with a quality education.
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Front page on foxnews.com
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Jon Solomon stirring the hornets' nest.
http://www.al.com/sports/index.ssf/2012/08/jovon_robinsons_transcript_rai.html
What a motherfucker.
Makes sure to stress that the cheating bastards did nothing wrong, but in his experience ( :taunt:) Auburn did.
This thing is going to end up with people dead.
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What a motherfucker.
Makes sure to stress that the cheating bastards did nothing wrong, but in his experience ( :taunt:) Auburn did.
This thing is going to end up with people dead.
Solomon made a mistake...he put the Hoover Grade Scandal back in writing (regardless if he tried to paint a blooming rose from a dead one, regarding uat's involvement). He did forget to mention that uat Assistant Coach Pruitt and Foley HC Coach Watson were present at Hoover for the Scandal (same ones involved with Darius Paige).
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Per Phillip Marshall, word is that Jovon will have to redshirt this year and will remain at Auburn University.
With Mason, Omac, Prosch, Grant and Blakely all older and poised for playing time, I doubt Jovon would have seen the field much this season anyway.
You said it well. Very little on field impact here. Just more muddied waters/smoke n mirrors you have to wade through to see this isn't that big of a deal. Most is being perpetuated.
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Agree on the suspicious timing of the allegation, but let me theorize another reason for it:
Miami sanctions.
Aubrey Hill just resigned from UF, and the speculation is that it's fallout from the impending shitstorm at Miami.
Didn't SPUAT coach Pannuzio coach at Miami very recently?
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And another thing...
Isn't it a bit fucked up that basically whatever mouthbreathing bama message board that reported this to the NCAA can have an eligible player sit out, for what will most likely be an entire season because of some false accusation with no recourse?
Doesn't that seem like abuse of the system? How many times must we be punished despite being exonerated time after time after time?
Why won't the NCAA listen to any of the billion cries of Alabama players receiving impermissible benefits, even if they're unfounded, so they will be forced to sit on the sidelines while the NCAA drags its feet?
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And another thing...
Isn't it a bit fucked up that basically whatever mouthbreathing bama message board that reported this to the NCAA can have an eligible player sit out, for what will most likely be an entire season because of some false accusation with no recourse?
Doesn't that seem like abuse of the system? How many times must we be punished despite being exonerated time after time after time?
Why won't the NCAA listen to any of the billion cries of Alabama players receiving impermissible benefits, even if they're unfounded, so they will be forced to sit on the sidelines while the NCAA drags its feet?
You see, I've got this friend. And he says it's bullshit. He says I need to check out those damn cheating Aubren fuckers. Yeah. He's about this tall. Why do you ask?
(http://blogs.ajc.com/jeff-schultz-blog/files/2011/08/NCAA_Presidential_Retreat.J.JPG)
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(http://www.tigersx.com/images/emert_gnome.jpg)
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(http://www.tigersx.com/images/emert_gnome.jpg)
I will love him and pet him, and I shall name him Nick!
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Meanwhile...uat announces 27 Secondary Violations (08-14-12)...including the Compliance Dept.
Football:
*- A student-athlete received a check for his scholarship before he'd received his final certification. The student-athlete was forced to pay the money back.
*- A member of the Crimson Tide coaching staff accepted a Facebook friend request before the permissible date for two prospective student-athletes. He was forced to de-friend the PSAs and have no correspondence with either of them for 60 days after the first permissible date.
*- A member of Nick Saban's staff sent an impermissible text message. He was banned from making phone calls for 30 days and received a letter of admonishment.
*- The staff provided "impermissible documents" to PSAs. The compliance department then provided the staff with education on "permissible formats for recruiting documents."
Nearly all of the 27 violations involved recruiting.
Rules education was provided for all of the violations, while a number of which came with various other consequences. (seriously? Rules education for coaches that've been doing this for YEARS? Give me a fuckin break)
*crickets*
Hey Pawwww, ESPN said that Reuben is being investigated by the NC2A...they gon burn Pawwww.
(btw, ESPN did make that statement as a headline...eventhough it's entirely FALSE)
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You said it well. Very little on field impact here. Just more muddied waters/smoke n mirrors you have to wade through to see this isn't that big of a deal. Most is being perpetuated.
I disagree. Robinson is the between the tackles bruiser we needed for the zone run game. And he's talented too. He was going to play. May have been like Dyer's Fr. season and not worked in much until later, but he was going to play and contribute.
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I disagree. Robinson is the between the tackles bruiser we needed for the zone run game. And he's talented too. He was going to play. May have been like Dyer's Fr. season and not worked in much until later, but he was going to play and contribute.
I don't disagree but we are also deeper at RB then we have been in years. I think you will be surprised by teh runnings of Mason and OMac behind the Juggernaut.
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*- The staff provided "impermissible documents" to PSAs. The compliance department then provided the staff with education on "permissible formats for recruiting documents."
What does this even mean?
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What does this even mean?
It means, "Hey son, here is the answers to that bullshit test you have to take to pass". "Hey coach, you're not suppose to give recruits cheat sheets to those bullshit test they have to take to pass".
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(http://www.tigersx.com/images/saban_em.jpg)
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:gold:
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I don't disagree but we are also deeper at RB then we have been in years. I think you will be surprised by teh runnings of Mason and OMac behind the Juggernaut.
An extra running back never hurts though, even if for a down or two per game.
Would have been nice to groom Robinson the same way we did Mason last year...
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An extra running back never hurts though, even if for a down or two per game.
Would have been nice to groom Robinson the same way we did Mason last year...
Agree, can't you tell I am self soothing. Gooooosefabra
WE roll 5 deep.
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An extra running back never hurts though, even if for a down or two per game.
Would have been nice to groom Robinson the same way we did Mason last year...
Grant and Blakely I'm sure can handle a couple carries a game.
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Meanwhile...uat announces 27 Secondary Violations (08-14-12)...including the Compliance Dept.
Football:
*- A student-athlete received a check for his scholarship before he'd received his final certification. The student-athlete was forced to pay the money back.
*- A member of the Crimson Tide coaching staff accepted a Facebook friend request before the permissible date for two prospective student-athletes. He was forced to de-friend the PSAs and have no correspondence with either of them for 60 days after the first permissible date.
*- A member of Nick Saban's staff sent an impermissible text message. He was banned from making phone calls for 30 days and received a letter of admonishment.
*- The staff provided "impermissible documents" to PSAs. The compliance department then provided the staff with education on "permissible formats for recruiting documents."
Nearly all of the 27 violations involved recruiting.
Rules education was provided for all of the violations, while a number of which came with various other consequences. (seriously? Rules education for coaches that've been doing this for YEARS? Give me a fuckin break)
*crickets*
Hey Pawwww, ESPN said that Reuben is being investigated by the NC2A...they gon burn Pawwww.
(btw, ESPN did make that statement as a headline...eventhough it's entirely FALSE)
So, the theory bears out: start a bullshit campaign against Auburn to deflect attention from 27 violations.
What impact, if any, do secondary violations have on a school's probationary status?
Follow up question: Secondary violations are usually self-reported/self-sanctioned to take the sting out of any looming NCAA penalties. Can this reporting by SPUAT be read to telegraph some larger penalty possibility?
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This just means the hammer is coming to Auburn
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Gooooosefabra
There's a ghost in my pants, there's a ghost in my pants.
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So, the theory bears out: start a bullshit campaign against Auburn to deflect attention from 27 violations.
What impact, if any, do secondary violations have on a school's probationary status?
Follow up question: Secondary violations are usually self-reported/self-sanctioned to take the sting out of any looming NCAA penalties. Can this reporting by SPUAT be read to telegraph some larger penalty possibility?
Secondary violations don't mean anything. They do nada. Squat. Zilch. Cero.
Slive spoke last summer about changing the NCAA rulebook. The main issues involve secondary violations, which really aren't violations at all. The rulebook is so thick and detailed that it's impossible to not accidentally commit a violation.
For example, when I worked in recruiting, before a game, the jumbotron displayed a shot of Kodi Burns and Tommy Tuberville talking. Boom. Secondary violation.
A recruit sends an assistant coach a Facebook request. The coach decides to check his Facebook and sees nine people have sent him a request. He goes ahead and clicks "yes" to all of them because he thinks they're all fans, but he failed to see the recruit's name, possibly because the recruit didn't use his real name but Jazzy Weezy Jeffy Fresh. Boom. Secondary violation.
During a "dead time" or some other arbitrary moment in the recruiting process, a recruit sends a coach a text message that asks something as simple as "Does Auburn wear orange and blue?" The coach responds, "Yes." Boom secondary violation.
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A recruit is nailing a sexy co-ed provided for him by the coaching staff on his official visit. He turns her around and slips that man-meat in her ass. Boom...secondary violation.
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So, the theory bears out: start a bullshit campaign against Auburn to deflect attention from 27 violations.
What impact, if any, do secondary violations have on a school's probationary status?
Follow up question: Secondary violations are usually self-reported/self-sanctioned to take the sting out of any looming NCAA penalties. Can this reporting by SPUAT be read to telegraph some larger penalty possibility?
I think that it's worth noting that the football program only self reported 4 violations. The number of 27 was for all athletic programs as a whole. Ole Miss recently reported a total of 44 secondary violations. The University of Memphis reported 24. Every year Alabama releases a report on all of the secondary violations that have been self-reported, so I don't see where this report is anything out of the ordinary.
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The real question I have is can Jazzy Weezy Jeffy Fresh play QB?
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I think that it's worth noting that the football program only self reported 4 violations. The number of 27 was for all athletic programs as a whole. Ole Miss recently reported a total of 44 secondary violations. The University of Memphis reported 24. Every year Alabama releases a report on all of the secondary violations that have been self-reported, so I don't see where this report is anything out of the ordinary.
Heads up. Incoming goat pic.
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Heads up. Incoming goat pic.
It ruins the surprise if you make an announcement.
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I think that it's worth noting that the football program only self reported 4 violations. The number of 27 was for all athletic programs as a whole. Ole Miss recently reported a total of 44 secondary violations. The University of Memphis reported 24. Every year Alabama releases a report on all of the secondary violations that have been self-reported, so I don't see where this report is anything out of the ordinary.
So Ole Miss > Alabama.
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So Ole Miss > Alabama.
That's how I read that.
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(http://www.tigersx.com/images/emert_pic.jpg)
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Per Phillip Marshall, word is that Jovon will have to redshirt this year and will remain at Auburn University.
With Mason, Omac, Prosch, Grant and Blakely all older and poised for playing time, I doubt Jovon would have seen the field much this season anyway.
I was hearing a lot of speculation that he would see pt this year. I think his size was what would help make his case for that.
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Jovon's in ineligible for 2012.
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Jovon's in ineligible for 2012.
Is that it? Not kicked out of Auburn? Not going to community college?
I can live with that.
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Also - pretty fucking disgusting that Danny Sheridan is #2 on al.com with his recent "I did take a lie detector test and passed it just ask me about it" comments at some Bammer gay boy luncheon.
Fuck this state.
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Is that it? Not kicked out of Auburn? Not going to community college?
I can live with that.
So far...
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I was hearing a lot of speculation that he would see pt this year. I think his size was what would help make his case for that.
You're correct, he would've seen PT, but now that he's been ruled ineligible for this season...Linebacker Chris Landrum has moved over to RB/FB.
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Is that it? Not kicked out of Auburn? Not going to community college?
I can live with that.
He will have to go to community college he is academically ineligible to study at Auburn.
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He will have to go to community college he is academically ineligible to study at Auburn.
Southern Union is 8 miles away.