Kickin' it with Coach Chizik....Part II

AuburnChopper 3.0 · « **Reply #60 on:** August 27, 2009, 10:26:45 AM »

Quote from: runswithscissors on August 27, 2009, 10:16:07 AM

I'm not comparing the coaches themselves to each other as much as I am comparing situations. Obviously, Shula had an optimal situation at Alabama with all of the tools and resources he could want. He was not a good coach, so he did not succeed. If you don't know how to use, or take advantage of your resources, or decipher what those resources give you, then they aren't doing you much good. Will Chizik be the next Shula? I don't know. I have my own opinion, but its just that. I'm simply giving you examples of situations and opportunities, and how they can be squandered.

Okay, but you started with this...

Quote from: runswithscissors on August 27, 2009, 09:52:16 AM

You guys want Shula as your next head coach? I mean, he would have alot of resources at his disposal. Auburn isn't the same place as Tuscaloosa. Its not the same situation. Soooo, he's guaranteed to be successful, right?

This is you pushing Shula as an equal to Chizik. It shows your lack of knowing the difference between ISU and Auburn, as opposed to the differences in AU vs. UA. Your backpeddling now and trying to justify. It's okay though. We understand.

RWS · « **Reply #61 on:** August 27, 2009, 10:30:27 AM »

Quote from: AuburnChopper2.0 on August 27, 2009, 10:26:45 AM

Okay, but you started with this...

This is you pushing Shula as an equal to Chizik. It shows your lack of knowing the difference between ISU and Auburn, as opposed to the differences in AU vs. UA. Your backpeddling now and trying to justify. It's okay though. We understand.

That was me asking if you would hire Shula as your next head coach.

AuburnChopper 3.0 · « **Reply #62 on:** August 27, 2009, 10:32:33 AM »

Quote from: runswithscissors on August 27, 2009, 10:30:27 AM

That was me asking if you would hire Shula as your next head coach.

No. ...and there was no reason to ask that if you weren't bringing in a Shula/ Chizik comparison.

Everyone sees this. It's okay.

RWS · « **Reply #63 on:** August 27, 2009, 10:33:23 AM »

Quote from: AuburnChopper2.0 on August 27, 2009, 10:32:33 AM

No. ...and there was no reason to ask that if you weren't bringing in a Shula/ Chizik comparison.

Everyone sees this. It's okay.

Jesus, maybe you are as dumb as Kaos says you are....Simply comparing things on a situational basis, Chopper. Very simple concept. I'm sorry your Chizik goggles won't allow you to see that. You see Chizik and Shula in the same sentence, and you automatically go into defense mode.

Godfather · « **Reply #64 on:** August 27, 2009, 10:35:30 AM »

Quote from: runswithscissors on August 27, 2009, 10:30:27 AM

That was me asking if you would hire Shula as your next head coach.

FAIL: I read that as you comparing Chizik to Shula as well. Nice try though.

wesfau2 · « **Reply #65 on:** August 27, 2009, 10:37:11 AM »

Quote from: runswithscissors on August 27, 2009, 10:16:07 AM

I'm not comparing the coaches themselves to each other as much as I am comparing situations. Obviously, Shula had an optimal situation at Alabama with all of the tools and resources he could want. He was not a good coach, so he did not succeed. If you don't know how to use, or take advantage of your resources, or decipher what those resources give you, then they aren't doing you much good. Will Chizik be the next Shula? I don't know. I have my own opinion, but its just that. I'm simply giving you examples of situations and opportunities, and how they can be squandered.

You're deliberately ignoring the two coaches' resumes prior to getting that first HC gig.

Chizik, as a non-head coach, is a DEMONSTRABLY better coach than Shula. Light-years ahead of the baby dolphin.

Shula never had, apart from the resources at Bama, any indications that he might ever succeed as a head coach.

Chizik has the pedigree, but his resume is tainted by a stop in a pit from which no one emerges victorious.

AuburnChopper 3.0 · « **Reply #66 on:** August 27, 2009, 10:40:12 AM »

Quote from: runswithscissors on August 27, 2009, 10:33:23 AM

Jesus, maybe you are as dumb as Kaos says you are....Simply comparing things on a situational basis, Chopper. Very simple concept. I'm sorry your Chizik goggles won't allow you to see that. You see Chizik and Shula in the same sentence, and you automatically go into defense mode.

No. Chizik goggles? I'm simply telling you you're wrong in your comparison. It doesn't have anything to do with support, or non support of Chizik. This whole "support", or "Chizdick Sucking Loons" thing is something you and Kaos made up. This is just a torn out page from Kaos's playbook that you try to use when you've struggled to make your argument.

RWS · « **Reply #67 on:** August 27, 2009, 10:40:49 AM »

Quote from: Godfather on August 27, 2009, 10:35:30 AM

FAIL: I read that as you comparing Chizik to Shula as well. Nice try though.

No. I was asking it hypothetically, because I knew the answer already. Nobody would want Shula because he is a fuck up, and can't win given all of the tools and support he could ever want. Chizik now has alot of tools and support. He hasn't coached his first game at AU yet, so its difficult to say whether he will be like Shula and squander his resources. Thats why I'm not comparing the two so much as coaches, but the situations they are/were in. The only reason I am comparing the SITUATIONS, is to illustrate that you can still manage to fuck up a head coaching job with lots of resources at your disposal. Not saying it WILL happen, but it can. Very. Simple.

wesfau2 · « **Reply #68 on:** August 27, 2009, 10:44:01 AM »

Quote from: runswithscissors on August 27, 2009, 10:40:49 AM

No. I was asking it hypothetically, because I knew the answer already. Nobody would want Shula because he is a fuck up, and can't win given all of the tools and support he could ever want. Chizik now has alot of tools and support. He hasn't coached his first game at AU yet, so its difficult to say whether he will be like Shula and squander his resources. Thats why I'm not comparing the two so much as coaches, but the situations they are/were in. The only reason I am comparing the SITUATIONS, is to illustrate that you can still manage to fuck up a head coaching job with lots of resources at your disposal. Not saying it WILL happen, but it can. Very. Simple.

There is no comparison in "situations" apart from bama and Auburn both being SEC schools and having the resources that membership affords them.

Shula's "situation" was that he was handed a job for which he was patently unqualified.

Chizik's "situation" is that he landed (or was handed, if you prefer) his job after rising, successfully, through the ranks of his profession, earning the highest accolades at every stop...except ISU. <insert ISU stats showing that losing is what they do there>.

Saniflush · « **Reply #69 on:** August 27, 2009, 10:46:17 AM »

Quote from: wesfau2 on August 27, 2009, 10:44:01 AM

<insert ISU stats showing that losing is what they do there>.

Like Maryland and crab cakes, baby

RWS · « **Reply #70 on:** August 27, 2009, 10:47:14 AM »

Quote from: wesfau2 on August 27, 2009, 10:37:11 AM

You're deliberately ignoring the two coaches' resumes prior to getting that first HC gig.

Chizik, as a non-head coach, is a DEMONSTRABLY better coach than Shula. Light-years ahead of the baby dolphin.

Shula never had, apart from the resources at Bama, any indications that he might ever succeed as a head coach.

Chizik has the pedigree, but his resume is tainted by a stop in a pit from which no one emerges victorious.

I don't give a shit what Nick Saban did at Kent State as a GA or assistant. I don't give a shit what he did at OSU. I don't care what he did at Navy, West Virginia, the Cleveland Browns, Houston Oilers, Syracuse, or Michigan State as a DC. What I care about is what he did as a head coach, because thats what he is now. Thats the experience that I care about. Its a whole new ball game when you're the big cheese. Thats the line of thinking that I think on.

wesfau2 · « **Reply #71 on:** August 27, 2009, 10:47:21 AM »

Quote from: Saniflush on August 27, 2009, 10:46:17 AM

Like Maryland and crab cakes, baby

Call me "Kitty".

Call me "Kitty Cat".

Saniflush · « **Reply #72 on:** August 27, 2009, 10:50:19 AM »

Quote from: wesfau2 on August 27, 2009, 10:47:21 AM

Call me "Kitty".

Call me "Kitty Cat".

You motor boated 'em didn't you. You ole sailor you.

wesfau2 · « **Reply #73 on:** August 27, 2009, 10:50:58 AM »

Quote from: Saniflush on August 27, 2009, 10:50:19 AM

You motor boated 'em didn't you. You ole sailor you.

Were they built for speed or comfort?

wesfau2 · « **Reply #74 on:** August 27, 2009, 10:55:26 AM »

Quote from: runswithscissors on August 27, 2009, 10:47:14 AM

I don't give a shit what Nick Saban did at Kent State as a GA or assistant. I don't give a shit what he did at OSU. I don't care what he did at Navy, West Virginia, the Cleveland Browns, Houston Oilers, Syracuse, or Michigan State as a DC. What I care about is what he did as a head coach, because thats what he is now. Thats the experience that I care about. Its a whole new ball game when you're the big cheese. Thats the line of thinking that I think on.

I get that HC is a whole different ball of wax than AC.

However, if I'm looking at two candidates (Shula and Chizik) for the same job (HC at an SEC school), then I will examine their resumes for performance at past positions.

In that analysis Chizik stomps a steaming mudhole in Shula's ass, and gives some valid basis for expecting Chizik to not fail miserably.

He might, of course, but there is nothing to indicate that he will...despite Kaos's myopic and delusional view of ISU.

RWS · « **Reply #75 on:** August 27, 2009, 10:55:46 AM »

Quote from: wesfau2 on August 27, 2009, 10:44:01 AM

Shula's "situation" was that he was handed a job for which he was patently unqualified.

Hindsight is 20/20. When he was hired, he had been an assistant in the NFL for 15 years. He was an OC for Tampa Bay from '96-'99, and they were 11-5 his last season there. He had experience as an assistant ABOVE NCAA football. So, 15 years as an NFL assistant makes you unqualified automatically? Does it make him an automatic success story? No, having shitty seasons as the head coach makes you unqualified, after the fact. I could just as easily cite whatever excuses that I want to explain Shula's failure. But, we all know he was simply a shitty head coach. Even with all of his experience in the NFL.

AuburnChopper 3.0 · « **Reply #76 on:** August 27, 2009, 10:56:14 AM »

Quote from: runswithscissors on August 27, 2009, 10:47:14 AM

I don't give a shit what Nick Saban did at Kent State as a GA or assistant. I don't give a shit what he did at OSU. I don't care what he did at Navy, West Virginia, the Cleveland Browns, Houston Oilers, Syracuse, or Michigan State as a DC. What I care about is what he did as a head coach, because thats what he is now. Thats the experience that I care about. Its a whole new ball game when you're the big cheese. Thats the line of thinking that I think on.

Nobody here disagrees with this. You bringing up Shula as any kind of representation for this comparison of situations was a complete stretch and was weak. That's all.

Godfather · « **Reply #77 on:** August 27, 2009, 10:57:37 AM »

Quote from: runswithscissors on August 27, 2009, 10:40:49 AM

No. I was asking it hypothetically, because I knew the answer already. Nobody would want Shula because he is a fuck up, and can't win given all of the tools and support he could ever want. Chizik now has alot of tools and support. He hasn't coached his first game at AU yet, so its difficult to say whether he will be like Shula and squander his resources. Thats why I'm not comparing the two so much as coaches, but the situations they are/were in. The only reason I am comparing the SITUATIONS, is to illustrate that you can still manage to fuck up a head coaching job with lots of resources at your disposal. Not saying it WILL happen, but it can. Very. Simple.

That might have been what you were trying to say, but thats not the way it came across.

wesfau2 · « **Reply #78 on:** August 27, 2009, 10:59:24 AM »

Quote from: runswithscissors on August 27, 2009, 10:55:46 AM

He was an OC for Tampa Bay from '96-'99, and they were 11-5 his last season there.

Thanks to Dungy and Kiffen. The Bucs were never higher than 22nd in total offense under his watch.

AWK · « **Reply #79 on:** August 27, 2009, 11:00:51 AM »

Quote from: War Eagle!!! on August 27, 2009, 10:16:10 AM

How may times can you fuckers argue the same. fucking. thing?

F U C K

I concur, the only logical way to solve this, is a fight to the death...in the Thunderdome.