What history tells us...

[Kaos]

     You have kind of a funny definition of mediocrity.  HDN is 6-5 against your Tigers.  Generally I wouldn't call someone mediocre when they have a winning record against my team, but that's just me.  Don't get me wrong, I'm glad we have Petrino, but HDN isn't the goof that a lot of people, including a lot of Arkansas fans, seem to think he is.

His record against Auburn is not necessarily an indicator of his overall lack of mediocrity. 

Mike Shula was 1-1 against Urban Meyer.  I guess Shula's pretty much on par with the Pope by your estimation.

[Hogwally]

     It was just a quick number to show the man is not the boob that some try to make him out to be.  I'll give you another, since he's been in the league, he's been to the SEC Championship game twice, same as Auburn and Alabama, and more than either of the Miss schools.  Granted he hasn't won there, but he came within a freshmen's muffed punt of it against the eventual National Champ.
     Look I'd just as soon he sucked as much as you guys seem to think he does.  He coaches for another team now and I would love to see Ole Miss be as sorry as they were under Ogeron.  The problem is the man has shown he can hold his own in the SEC West, and I don't think he's going away anytime soon.

[RWS]

     It was just a quick number to show the man is not the boob that some try to make him out to be.  I'll give you another, since he's been in the league, he's been to the SEC Championship game twice, same as Auburn and Alabama, and more than either of the Miss schools.  Granted he hasn't won there, but he came within a freshmen's muffed punt of it against the eventual National Champ.
     

Close only counts in horseshoes and Auburn recruiting.

[Snaggletiger]

Close only counts in horseshoes and Auburn recruiting.

Bugger off!!

Now, back to Nutt.  I've never thought the guy was a bad coach by any stretch.  Several of our resident regulars seem to have the inside scoop on what went down during his Arky fall from grace.  But, with regard to his coaching ability, I think there needs to be a distinction made.  In my somewhat humble opinion, aw the hell with that, I know everything...I think there are limits as to how CONSISTENTLY good Arkansas can be.  That goes for Auburn as well.  Can they both be minimum 8-9 win teams with the occasional 10-12 win season and SEC championships thrown in?  Yes, and both should be.  But, due to location, conference affiliation and other factors, I don't think either has the ability to be a real playa on the national seen year in and year out like a Texas or USC or even Ohio State. 

Having said that, I think Nutt and likewise with Tuberville, came about as close to that with their respective programs as anyone is going to do.  It was time for a change in both scenarios but during their tenures, both guys had stretches where they maximized the potential that was there.   

[Hogwally]

Close only counts in horseshoes and Auburn recruiting.

     Well I guess Alabama has plenty of room to talk in this discussion, you've got a stellar 6-5 record against Mr. Mediocre.  Woohoo, we're a half game above mediocre!

[AUChizad]

     Well I guess Alabama has plenty of room to talk in this discussion, you've got a stellar 6-5 record against Mr. Mediocre.  Woohoo, we're a half game above mediocre!

Remind him how many SEC championships they've won in that timeframe he is commenting on...

[wesfau2]

I think there are limits as to how CONSISTENTLY good Arkansas can be.  That goes for Auburn as well.  Can they both be minimum 8-9 win teams with the occasional 10-12 win season and SEC championships thrown in?  Yes, and both should be.  But, due to location, conference affiliation and other factors, I don't think either has the ability to be a real playa on the national seen year in and year out like a Texas or USC or even Ohio State. 

Horseshit quitter talk.

[Kaos]

     It was just a quick number to show the man is not the boob that some try to make him out to be.  I'll give you another, since he's been in the league, he's been to the SEC Championship game twice, same as Auburn and Alabama, and more than either of the Miss schools.  Granted he hasn't won there, but he came within a freshmen's muffed punt of it against the eventual National Champ.
     Look I'd just as soon he sucked as much as you guys seem to think he does.  He coaches for another team now and I would love to see Ole Miss be as sorry as they were under Ogeron.  The problem is the man has shown he can hold his own in the SEC West, and I don't think he's going away anytime soon.

No, he's a decent coach, but his personality gets in the way sometimes. 

He is not the face I would want for my program.  He always seemed to be up in some shenanigans.  And he was too emotional.  I sometimes felt like the Arkansas team rose and fell on his moods and that it was more a cult of personality than anything else.  When you've got a volatile, mercurial guy like that you're not going to have any kind of real consistency or long-lasting success.   

That's my book. 

The perfect head coach? 

Keeps his emotions in check and thinks before he talks. 

Knows the meaning of the word discretion in both his personal and professional life.

Understands the role of the media and uses it to his advantage.

Is not reactionary, but always looking to better himself, his staff and the program.

Provides moral and spiritual guidance not in what he says, but in what he does.

Hires assistants who fit the same basic mold, always looking to surround himself with people more intelligent than he is.

Respects and understands the game of football, but more importantly respects and understands the institution he represents.

Is arrogant enough to be confident in his abilities, but humble enough to make changes and adjustments as the situation warrants.

Presents himself as firm and decisive and takes responsibility for his performance, the performance of his staff and the performance of the team -- on and off the field.

He understands that the program is bigger than any one man, including himself.

And he also has to win.  Yeah.  Win.  There's that. 

[Godfather]

No, he's a decent coach, but his personality gets in the way sometimes. 

He is not the face I would want for my program.  He always seemed to be up in some shenanigans.  And he was too emotional.  I sometimes felt like the Arkansas team rose and fell on his moods and that it was more a cult of personality than anything else.  When you've got a volatile, mercurial guy like that you're not going to have any kind of real consistency or long-lasting success.   

That's my book. 

The perfect head coach? 

Keeps his emotions in check and thinks before he talks. 

Knows the meaning of the word discretion in both his personal and professional life.

Understands the role of the media and uses it to his advantage.

Is not reactionary, but always looking to better himself, his staff and the program.

Provides moral and spiritual guidance not in what he says, but in what he does.

Hires assistants who fit the same basic mold, always looking to surround himself with people more intelligent than he is.

Respects and understands the game of football, but more importantly respects and understands the institution he represents.

Is arrogant enough to be confident in his abilities, but humble enough to make changes and adjustments as the situation warrants.

Presents himself as firm and decisive and takes responsibility for his performance, the performance of his staff and the performance of the team -- on and off the field.

He understands that the program is bigger than any one man, including himself.

And he also has to win.  Yeah.  Win.  There's that. 

Why do you hate Living Colour?

[Snaggletiger]

Horseshit quitter talk.

Well, since Auburn has never done it in it's entire illustrious history dating back well over 100 years, I'd say it's anything but quitter talk.  Add the fact that 85 scholarships have limited only an elite few to that status, outside a nice "Run" now and then, and I'll take 8-9 wins at a minimum each year with the occasional run at a MNC.  If that ain't good enough, you're gonna' spend a lot of time being let down and heartbroken.

[wesfau2]

Well, since Auburn has never done it in it's entire illustrious history dating back well over 100 years, I'd say it's anything but quitter talk.  Add the fact that 85 scholarships have limited only an elite few to that status, outside a nice "Run" now and then, and I'll take 8-9 wins at a minimum each year with the occasional run at a MNC.  If that ain't good enough, you're gonna' spend a lot of time being let down and heartbroken.

If your point is that the scholarship limit has eliminated the days of dynasty teams, then I'll agree. 

[JR4AU]

Well, since Auburn has never done it in it's entire illustrious history dating back well over 100 years, I'd say it's anything but quitter talk.  Add the fact that 85 scholarships have limited only an elite few to that status, outside a nice "Run" now and then, and I'll take 8-9 wins at a minimum each year with the occasional run at a MNC.  If that ain't good enough, you're gonna' spend a lot of time being let down and heartbroken.

Harv,

I would agree with you if you had said it's more difficult to maintain elite status at Auburn than say at a place like Florida, or LSU, but is has been done, and can be done.  Ark's situation and Auburn's are completely different.  Their physical location is a big problem for them in recruiting.  Ark doesn't produce enough talent to supply an SEC team with the players they need, so they have to go out and steal players elsewhere.  And the players they're in the market to steal would probably first choose TX, Tx A&M, OK, Nebraska, Mizzou, Kansas, etc.  Their competing against not only big name programs, but another conference.  The in the SEC they have to steal from MS, LA, and TN.  It's a tough sell in conference too.   Auburn, on the other hand, has been and maintained an elite program.  We're #14 in all time winning percentage.  We are nationally known.  And we can and do recruit our state region well, most of the time.  It's harder to maintain that status, but it's possible.  It might be possible at Ark, but it's harder than at Auburn.  I think Nutt is a pretty good coach, but I'd agree with Kaos' assessment, I wouldn't want him as Auburn's head coach. 

[Snaggletiger]

That has as much to do with it as anything; however, the few schools that currently have anything close to what could be called a dynasty in this day and age, all have some built in advantages over Auburn, and always will.  By "Dynasty" I mean consistently being a top 5 playa for the MNC.  Love em' or hate em' USC, Texas, OSU, now UF and to some extent, LSU all share some of those advantages in one way or another.  I'm not saying AU can't be a consistent winner, they've shown that ability in the past and their record bears that out.    

[RWS]

     Well I guess Alabama has plenty of room to talk in this discussion, you've got a stellar 6-5 record against Mr. Mediocre.  Woohoo, we're a half game above mediocre!

I'm not here proclaiming we're better than Arkansas either, or how close we've been to winning this or that. If you haven't noticed, the past decade or so has been a pretty shitty time to be an Alabama fan.

[JR4AU]

If your point is that the scholarship limit has eliminated the days of dynasty teams, then I'll agree. 

It's had that effect somewhat, but I think the bigger effect is that it's allowed more programs to compete at a higher level, ie Boise St, and the like.  

[wesfau2]

That has as much to do with it as anything; however, the few schools that currently have anything close to what could be called a dynasty in this day and age, all have some built in advantages over Auburn, and always will.  By "Dynasty" I mean consistently being a top 5 playa for the MNC.  Love em' or hate em' USC, Texas, OSU, now UF and to some extent, LSU all share some of those advantages in one way or another.  I'm not saying AU can't be a consistent winner, they've shown that ability in the past and their record bears that out.    

If by "built-in advantages" you mean that they have the media sucking their respective programs off every Saturday, then I'll agree with this, too.

[Godfather]

That has as much to do with it as anything; however, the few schools that currently have anything close to what could be called a dynasty in this day and age, all have some built in advantages over Auburn, and always will.  By "Dynasty" I mean consistently being a top 5 playa for the MNC.  Love em' or hate em' USC, Texas, OSU, now UF and to some extent, LSU all share some of those advantages in one way or another.  I'm not saying AU can't be a consistent winner, they've shown that ability in the past and their record bears that out.    

If by "built-in advantages" you mean that they have the media sucking their respective programs off every Saturday, then I'll agree with this, too.

LAWYER FIGHT!!!!!!

The white zone is for loading and unloading, there is no parking in the red zone!

[Kaos]

That has as much to do with it as anything; however, the few schools that currently have anything close to what could be called a dynasty in this day and age, all have some built in advantages over Auburn, and always will.  By "Dynasty" I mean consistently being a top 5 playa for the MNC.  Love em' or hate em' USC, Texas, OSU, now UF and to some extent, LSU all share some of those advantages in one way or another.  I'm not saying AU can't be a consistent winner, they've shown that ability in the past and their record bears that out.    

LSU went the better part of 50 years without said advantage.  Their "rise" is a relatively new phenomenon. Up until that midget cocksucker got there LSU was basically Ole Miss with a better uniform.

Frankly, Auburn was better positioned to take the "advantage" that LSU now owns, but we shot ourselves in the face in 2003.  Repeatedly. 

We also shot ourselves in the face in 2001.  Here's the funny thing about 2001.  If we'd played LSU when scheduled -- right after September 11 -- I think we would have won that game.  But we got to the end of the season, laid an egg at Arkansas and let the disappointment over unfulfilled promise turn AU into quitters.  I can tell you for absolute certain that I'd never seen an AU team mail it in and quit until I saw the 2001 team roll over and play dead against a weak Bama team.  No emotion.

We play LSU when we're supposed to and AU wins that game.  Could have changed the next five years...

[Snaggletiger]

If by "built-in advantages" you mean that they have the media sucking their respective programs off every Saturday, then I'll agree with this, too.

Bingo.  Big market teams are always going to get more than their share of media bobo honkage.  Auburn is small town America.  The Lovliest Village.  We know the potential of Auburn and what it has to offer, but the rest of the country doesn't care.  It's more sexy for the Game Day crew to suck Pete Carroll's man meat.  

  

[Snaggletiger]

LSU went the better part of 50 years without said advantage.  Their "rise" is a relatively new phenomenon. Up until that midget cocksucker got there LSU was basically Ole Miss with a better uniform.

That's why they were prefaced with "To some extent".  Again, a dynasty in modern day is most likely going to look like the 8-10 year run that most of these schools are on.  LSU has 2 MNC's in a 7 year period.