Tuberville: Time to move on

AuburnChopper 3.0 · « **Reply #20 on:** December 04, 2008, 09:58:17 AM »

I agree about Kragthorpe.. I can't imagine why his name was brought up. No sense at all.

CCTAU · « **Reply #21 on:** December 04, 2008, 10:00:09 AM »

Leach didn't win 10 games a year due to the defense. He just showed this year that if you have a defense with his offense, you can win. UF does not beat people down with their offense, it's their defense that does the heavy lifting. The teams that control the ball against UF have a chance. Their offense is gonna score, but with a defense not allowing the other team to score, it allows the spread to flourish.

If he came in and kept our defense and implemented his offense, I think we would see a team that is consistently on par with UF.

But on the other hand, I do like to see an offense that just whips ass. The spread doesn't really do that.

How many other guys on that list have an offense that is more pro based?

wesfau2 · « **Reply #22 on:** December 04, 2008, 10:02:09 AM »

Quote from: CCTAU on December 04, 2008, 10:00:09 AM

UF does not beat people down with their offense

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Quote

But on the other hand, I do like to see an offense that just whips ass. The spread doesn't really do that.

=

you're retarded.

Snaggletiger · « **Reply #23 on:** December 04, 2008, 10:04:48 AM »

I second the Pale Gaytor. This wish list must be thrown in with the chestnuts roasting on an open fire and burned to hell.

AuburnChopper 3.0 · « **Reply #24 on:** December 04, 2008, 10:10:34 AM »

My actual list....

(in no specific order)

1. Muschamp
2. Davis
3. Peterson
4. Gill
5. Kelley

I think ALL of them have a debate going either way, but I could live with any of them.

CCTAU · « **Reply #25 on:** December 04, 2008, 10:15:57 AM »

Quote from: wesfuf2 on December 04, 2008, 10:02:09 AM

+

=

you're retarded.

Up yours. If the UF defense did not stop the other guy, the offense would not have the chance. Therefore they are not the ones that are really beating up the other guy, the defense is.

Kiss my retarded ass. The spread is an explosive offense that does not usually consume a lot of time off of the clock. If you have a shitty defense, then the spread does not get a chance to explode often. So it is the defense that wins games on a spread team more so than the offense. If you would bother look at T. Tech this year you will notice the only thing different is they have a much better defense.

Please work on your math skills so you can put 2 + 2 together a little easier.

I love it when one of you internet bad guys call others names.

AuburnChopper 3.0 · « **Reply #26 on:** December 04, 2008, 10:22:41 AM »

Quote from: CCTAU on December 04, 2008, 10:15:57 AM

Up yours. If the UF defense did not stop the other guy, the offense would not have the chance. Therefore they are not the ones that are really beating up the other guy, the defense is.

Kiss my retarded ass. The spread is an explosive offense that does not usually consume a lot of time off of the clock. If you have a shitty defense, then the spread does not get a chance to explode often. So it is the defense that wins games on a spread team more so than the offense. If you would bother look at T. Tech this year you will notice the only thing different is they have a much better defense.

Please work on your math skills so you can put 2 + 2 together a little easier.

I love it when one of you internet bad guys call others names.

Your argument is based on UF's offense not being productive? Your argument is based on UF's defense being the primary reason behind their success?

Fail.

Kaos · « **Reply #27 on:** December 04, 2008, 10:25:25 AM »

Quote from: CCTAU on December 04, 2008, 10:00:09 AM

Leach didn't win 10 games a year due to the defense. He just showed this year that if you have a defense with his offense, you can win. UF does not beat people down with their offense, it's their defense that does the heavy lifting. The teams that control the ball against UF have a chance. Their offense is gonna score, but with a defense not allowing the other team to score, it allows the spread to flourish.

If he came in and kept our defense and implemented his offense, I think we would see a team that is consistently on par with UF.

But on the other hand, I do like to see an offense that just whips ass. The spread doesn't really do that.

How many other guys on that list have an offense that is more pro based?

Leach didn't win TEN GAMES A YEAR. The putz won TEN GAMES THIS YEAR. Big, huge, gigantic, massive, major difference.

Over his career he's a four-plus loss per year guy. The ultimate dud. Please, I pray this isn't the route we go down.

LOOK AT TCU, LOOK AT TCU, LOOK AT TCU.

Kaos · « **Reply #28 on:** December 04, 2008, 10:28:40 AM »

Quote from: GatorChopper1 on December 04, 2008, 10:10:34 AM

My actual list....

(in no specific order)

1. Muschamp
2. Davis
3. Peterson
4. Gill
5. Kelley

I think ALL of them have a debate going either way, but I could live with any of them.

Sorry, but I recoil and boo loudly at your entire list.

Muschamp has never even put his own diapers on.
Davis is a retread.
Peterson is the only one I'd be mildly excited about.
Gill is a one-hit wonder. No gravitas
Kelley... *yawn*

At least you didn't put Leach on there.

Somebody, anybody PLEASE get Jacobs to look at TCU. That guy is the ticket.

CCTAU · « **Reply #29 on:** December 04, 2008, 10:29:01 AM »

Quote from: GatorChopper1 on December 04, 2008, 10:22:41 AM

Your argument is based on UF's offense not being productive? Your argument is based on UF's defense being the primary reason behind their success?

Fail.

Not so. My argument is that UF's offense does not score every time it touches the ball. If you limit the touches, then you have a chance. But the more chances their offense gets, the higher the percentage of scores. And the more the other team's defense gets tired. This all goes back to why TT is doing well this year. They have a good defense. If UF had a weak defense, then the offense would not get as many chances.We see what happens when their defense does not play as well. Ole Miss controlled the ball and limited UF's offense. So it seems that the spread will most likely be successful if you have a strong defense. Otherwise, you have 4 losses year...just like TT in the past.

This example was show that in the SEC, the spread can be successful, but only if you have a strong defense. And that is where UF's success has come from, their defense.

Kaos · « **Reply #30 on:** December 04, 2008, 10:31:43 AM »

Quote from: CCTAU on December 04, 2008, 10:29:01 AM

Not so. My argument is that UF's offense does not score every time it touches the ball. If you limit the touches, then you have a chance. But the more chances their offense gets, the higher the percentage of scores. And the more the other team's defense gets tired. This all goes back to why TT is doing well this year. They have a good defense. If UF had a weak defense, then the offense would not get as many chances.We see what happens when their defense does not play as well. Ole Miss controlled the ball and limited UF's offense. So it seems that the spread will most likely be successful if you have a strong defense. Otherwise, you have 4 losses year...just like TT in the past.

This example was show that in the SEC, the spread can be successful, but only if you have a strong defense. And that is where UF's success has come from, their defense.

I agree with others. Your argument fails.

Does Tebow play defense? I didn't think so.

It's like saying the only reason my car runs is because it has doors.

AuburnChopper 3.0 · « **Reply #31 on:** December 04, 2008, 10:34:01 AM »

Quote from: CCTAU on December 04, 2008, 10:29:01 AM

Not so. My argument is that UF's offense does not score every time it touches the ball. If you limit the touches, then you have a chance. But the more chances their offense gets, the higher the percentage of scores. And the more the other team's defense gets tired. This all goes back to why TT is doing well this year. They have a good defense. If UF had a weak defense, then the offense would not get as many chances.We see what happens when their defense does not play as well. Ole Miss controlled the ball and limited UF's offense. So it seems that the spread will most likely be successful if you have a strong defense. Otherwise, you have 4 losses year...just like TT in the past.

This example was show that in the SEC, the spread can be successful, but only if you have a strong defense. And that is where UF's success has come from, their defense.

While your basic and simplistic arguement is technically correct, I think you're stretching one role to bolster another. It could be argued either way. (ie, ball control can also be controlled by the offense, therefore leaving the other teams offense off the field. Look at AU vs. SC a few years ago when the Auburn offense kept the ball the entire 3rd quarter).

However, I would assert that a majority of UF's success this year had to do with offense. Not so much a stellar defense.

CCTAU · « **Reply #32 on:** December 04, 2008, 10:42:05 AM »

Quote from: GatorChopper1 on December 04, 2008, 10:34:01 AM

While your basic and simplistic arguement is technically correct, I think you're stretching one role to bolster another. It could be argued either way. (ie, ball control can also be controlled by the offense, therefore leaving the other teams offense off the field. Look at AU vs. SC a few years ago when the Auburn offense kept the ball the entire 3rd quarter).

However, I would assert that a majority of UF's success this year had to do with offense. Not so much a stellar defense.

So conversely, would you say that TT's success has been due to mostly offense and that their defense has jsut been so-so?

I did not say the defense had to be stellar, just good. In the past, TT's defense has not even been good. You give UF a so-so defense and they become irrelevant. No way Tebow beats 12 teams without a good defense. That was my argument when looking at TT and Leach. The same was said about Meyer before he got here. But when he got here, he knew that he would need a defense to in the SEC. Was it the spread offense that won the NC, or was it the ferocious defense that shut down OSU. The point is that the spread can work in the SEC if you maintain an SEC caliber defense. UF has a great offense, but so does TT. But UF's defense is much better than TT's. That is the reason for UF's continued success.

BTW. Technically correct is still correct. :thumbsup:

Kaos · « **Reply #33 on:** December 04, 2008, 10:50:35 AM »

Quote from: CCTAU on December 04, 2008, 10:42:05 AM

So conversely, would you say that TT's success has been due to mostly offense and that their defense has jsut been so-so?

I did not say the defense had to be stellar, just good. In the past, TT's defense has not even been good. You give UF a so-so defense and they become irrelevant. No way Tebow beats 12 teams without a good defense. That was my argument when looking at TT and Leach. The same was said about Meyer before he got here. But when he got here, he knew that he would need a defense to in the SEC. Was it the spread offense that won the NC, or was it the ferocious defense that shut down OSU. The point is that the spread can work in the SEC if you maintain an SEC caliber defense. UF has a great offense, but so does TT. But UF's defense is much better than TT's. That is the reason for UF's continued success.

Meyer had a stellar record. He'd done amazing jobs at both Bowling Green and Utah. It was foolish of me and of others like me to think that his success was related only to his "system."

Either a guy can coach or he can't. Here's a clue for you:

MIKE LEACH CAN'T COACH

Here is his record at Texas Tech prior to this season:

7-6
7-5
9-5
8-5
8-4
9-3
8-5
9-4

Six, five, five, five, four, three, five, four. FUCK THAT. It absolutely reeks of mediocrity. Add the fact that he's a certifiable nutjob and you have a recipe for disaster that will make unicorns and baby kittens weep uncontrollably.

The guy can't coach. He's a mediocre coach at best. Do you honestly think it will be easier for him to recruit in the SEC than it was in the Big Joke 12? Do you think the level of overall competition will be higher or lower in the SEC?

That AU is even considering this pedestrian dud makes me violently ill. If Jacobs is so stupid as to hire him, I might just jump off Chopper's proverbial bridge.

wesfau2 · « **Reply #34 on:** December 04, 2008, 10:55:19 AM »

Quote from: CCTAU on December 04, 2008, 10:15:57 AM

Up yours. If the UF defense did not stop the other guy, the offense would not have the chance. Therefore they are not the ones that are really beating up the other guy, the defense is.

Kiss my retarded ass. The spread is an explosive offense that does not usually consume a lot of time off of the clock. If you have a shitty defense, then the spread does not get a chance to explode often. So it is the defense that wins games on a spread team more so than the offense. If you would bother look at T. Tech this year you will notice the only thing different is they have a much better defense.

Please work on your math skills so you can put 2 + 2 together a little easier.

I love it when one of you internet bad guys call others names.

Your stupid fucking argument works for every offensive scheme known to man: if the defense doesn't stop the other team, then you don't get the ball back to try to score.

No shit.

AuburnChopper 3.0 · « **Reply #35 on:** December 04, 2008, 10:58:21 AM »

Well, wesfuf2 just saved me the statement.

CCTAU · « **Reply #36 on:** December 04, 2008, 11:02:25 AM »

Quote from: GatorsGhost on December 04, 2008, 10:50:35 AM

Meyer had a stellar record. He'd done amazing jobs at both Bowling Green and Utah. It was foolish of me and of others like me to think that his success was related only to his "system."

But you did prejudge him and you were wrong. Could it be that you would be wrong about Leach too?

I don't care either way, but I won't dismiss him because of his record at TT. Coaching at TT is like coaching at Ole Miss or Miss. State. You will always lose to the big boys except for every few years due to not getting the talent. AU WILL always get the talent.

And Utah didn't exactly play the same type of schedule that TT plays. I'm just saying that the spread can work in the SEC as long as you maintain a SEC caliber defense. Whether Leach is the guy for that remains to be seen. Like you said, we all said the same thing about Meyer.

wesfau2 · « **Reply #37 on:** December 04, 2008, 11:08:26 AM »

Quote from: CCTAU on December 04, 2008, 11:02:25 AM

But you did prejudge him and you were wrong. Could it be that you would be wrong about Leach too?

Meyer had eye-popping success at every coaching stop.

Leach has had middle of the road results every year prior to this one at one coaching stop.

Apples vs. oranges.

CCTAU · « **Reply #38 on:** December 04, 2008, 11:08:53 AM »

Quote from: wesfuf2 on December 04, 2008, 10:55:19 AM

Your stupid fucking argument works for every offensive scheme known to man: if the defense doesn't stop the other team, then you don't get the ball back to try to score.

No shit.

Yep. The subtleties of football escape the fans once again. If you actually sat down and looked at the intrinsics of the game, you would see that it's a little more involved than that. The argument still stands. The spread will only be effective if you maintain a SEC caliber defense. Leach could be successful here, or not. But like UF, do you take a chance on that.

I would love to see any of you naysayers actually coach a game. Give it a shot. More things are happening than just what you see on the TV. But to dismiss a coach because he runs the spread shows a lack of understanding of the game.

wesfau2 · « **Reply #39 on:** December 04, 2008, 11:10:56 AM »

Quote from: CCTAU on December 04, 2008, 11:08:53 AM

Yep. The subtleties of football escape the fans once again. If you actually sat down and looked at the intrinsics of the game, you would see that it's a little more involved than that. The argument still stands. The spread will only be effective if you maintain a SEC caliber defense. Leach could be successful here, or not. But like UF, do you take a chance on that.

You seem to have gotten your arguments crossed up.

I'm not opposed to the spread. I'm opposed to Mike Leach.

Your argument was that UF doesn't blow people away on offense, they win with defense. That assertion is demonstrably false and fucking stupid.

Quote

I would love to see any of you naysayers actually coach a game. Give it a shot. More things are happening than just what you see on the TV. But to dismiss a coach because he runs the spread shows a lack of understanding of the game.

How many collegiate level games have you coached?