O's $250K Threshhold

[Tiger Wench]

Someone tell me how making $250K makes you rich?  For a family with two college educated working adults in their 40's or older, who have had a stable career path, a $250K gross combined income is not that unheard of.  Carl and I are not there, but we aren't THAT far off - but we also have two small kids and a mortgage and two college educations to pay for and retirement to worry about - some people also have student loans that paid for that college education/law school/med school.  I certainly don't feel rich - not by a long shot.  We work  like dogs to earn our paychecks, and we have also agreed that we will NOT carry any unsecured debt.  No credit card debt - PERIOD.  And we do not have any - none.  We have chosen to save save save and not live beyond our means.  Yet O thinks that makes me rich...

And that $250K is GROSS income - once it gets taxed all to hell and back,  you aren't making $250K anymore.  Instead you have just worked your ass off to be a success so you can help support others who haven't tried as hard and could give a shit about personal responsibility.  I have a real problem with that.  If I want to donate to a charity, I should get to decide who gets my hard earned money.  i don't need some fucking democrat to do it for me.

[Kaos]

Someone tell me how making $250K makes you rich?  For a family with two college educated working adults in their 40's or older, who have had a stable career path, a $250K gross combined income is not that unheard of.  Carl and I are not there, but we aren't THAT far off - but we also have two small kids and a mortgage and two college educations to pay for and retirement to worry about - some people also have student loans that paid for that college education/law school/med school.  I certainly don't feel rich - not by a long shot.  We work  like dogs to earn our paychecks, and we have also agreed that we will NOT carry any unsecured debt.  No credit card debt - PERIOD.  And we do not have any - none.  We have chosen to save save save and not live beyond our means.  Yet O thinks that makes me rich...

And that $250K is GROSS income - once it gets taxed all to hell and back,  you aren't making $250K anymore.  Instead you have just worked your ass off to be a success so you can help support others who haven't tried as hard and could give a shit about personal responsibility.  I have a real problem with that.  If I want to donate to a charity, I should get to decide who gets my hard earned money.  i don't need some fucking democrat to do it for me.

You're rich.  You should pay for stuff for me.

[AUTiger1]

Someone tell me how making $250K makes you rich?  For a family with two college educated working adults in their 40's or older, who have had a stable career path, a $250K gross combined income is not that unheard of.  Carl and I are not there, but we aren't THAT far off - but we also have two small kids and a mortgage and two college educations to pay for and retirement to worry about - some people also have student loans that paid for that college education/law school/med school.  I certainly don't feel rich - not by a long shot.  We work  like dogs to earn our paychecks, and we have also agreed that we will NOT carry any unsecured debt.  No credit card debt - PERIOD.  And we do not have any - none.  We have chosen to save save save and not live beyond our means.  Yet O thinks that makes me rich...

And that $250K is GROSS income - once it gets taxed all to hell and back,  you aren't making $250K anymore.  Instead you have just worked your ass off to be a success so you can help support others who haven't tried as hard and could give a shit about personal responsibility.  I have a real problem with that.  If I want to donate to a charity, I should get to decide who gets my hard earned money.  i don't need some fucking democrat to do it for me.

I had this debate with some people who made a big deal out of McCain's houses and cars and what is rich comment.  I don't think that making $250K a year makes you rich, I think it makes you comfortable, but does not make you rich.  For example, lets say my neighbor and his wife both knock down $125K/each a year.  That is $250K, now they have oh...lets say 3 kids, mortgage, college loans to pay back (since Michelle Obama bitched about hers at more than likely less than 2% interest), a couple of cars, all kids have to have braces, glasses, all that shit.....Now I make $185K and I am single and I live next door to the couple, remember I have heard Obama say that if you make less than $200K a year then your taxes will actually get cut.  So, with 3 kids and all the stuff that comes with kids, such as braces, glasses, the doctor trips, 3 mouths to feed, how is it that they are considered rich, when the guy making $185K/year who is single with no kids and can better afford things, not be considered rich.  Does that make sense to anyone?   Hell I am clueless as how to define rich. That is another thing that bother me, given the example I just provided (I know a piss-poor one) why in the hell does the family that makes the $250K have to have their taxes increased, especially if they have kids who are going to cost them money?  I don't know, personally don't have any, but from hearing my friends speak, and my parents comments, it sounds like it cost a butt load of money to raise a kid(s).

[AUTailgatingRules]

Here is the problem with raping the "rich".  If you make enough money to have disposable income, you then take that disposable income and buy things, or invest, or start a small business, or even just save it.  Well if you decide to buy shit wiith your disposable income you are actually creating jobs for the line worker that is making the shit you buy.  If you decide to invest it you are providing capital to companies that will use it to pay line workers to make products for others to buy.  Well you start to get the drift, if you take disposable money from these people they quit buying shit and quit investing.  If they quit these things, people lose jobs.  If you give the rich people's money to the poor and middle class, they may buy some shit, but odds are they will not invest. 

As I have always said to my democrat friends, "when is the last time you got a job from a poor person?"

BTW $250,000/year is not even close to being rich.  The problem is that with the class warefare the dems espouse, most of the $25,000 -$50,000/year earners see no chance of ever making $250,000/year; therefore they all just say fuck the rich and tax the hell out of them and maybe they will feel "my" pain.  The problem is when they lose that job that the small business owner gave them they never can undersand what the hell happened.

[AUTiger1]

Here is the problem with raping the "rich".  If you make enough money to have disposable income, you then take that disposable income and buy things, or invest, or start a small business, or even just save it.  Well if you decide to buy shit wiith your disposable income you are actually creating jobs for the line worker that is making the shit you buy.  If you decide to invest it you are providing capital to companies that will use it to pay line workers to make products for others to buy.  Well you start to get the drift, if you take disposable money from these people they quit buying shit and quit investing.  If they quit these things, people lose jobs.  If you give the rich people's money to the poor and middle class, they may buy some shit, but odds are they will not invest. 

Now only if you could get some to believe in that.  Does anyone remember Clinton's luxury taxes?  Kinda ruined a few yacht builders, jobs were lost, businesses were shutdown and nothing was left except a bunch of empty buildings for lease. 

[Tarheel]

Here is the problem with raping the "rich".  If you make enough money to have disposable income, you then take that disposable income and buy things, or invest, or start a small business, or even just save it.  Well if you decide to buy shit wiith your disposable income you are actually creating jobs for the line worker that is making the shit you buy.  If you decide to invest it you are providing capital to companies that will use it to pay line workers to make products for others to buy.  Well you start to get the drift, if you take disposable money from these people they quit buying shit and quit investing.  If they quit these things, people lose jobs.  If you give the rich people's money to the poor and middle class, they may buy some shit, but odds are they will not invest. 
...

Obviously you have not heard but The Obama has already proclaimed the principle of trickle-down economics a failure.  He's going to give us hope and change and change and hope for a new style of economics...something that we can believe in...

[GarMan]

Obviously you have not heard but The Obama has already proclaimed the principle of trickle-down economics a failure.  He's going to give us hope and change and change and hope for a new style of economics...something that we can believe in...

Yeah...  Marxism.

The party of feelings, class-warfare, envy and contempt is alive and well.  It's about wealth redistribution and get-even-with-em-ism.  The lower socio-economic classes will not do better because the higher classes are taxed more, but they'll feel better because higher wage earners will be penalized for their successes.  I heard it again today.  The average person who earns less than $50k per year works an average of 40 hours per week, while the average person who earns more than $100k per week works more than 70 hours per week.  People who work harder are just plain greedy! 

[Townhallsavoy]

It depends on whom you are talking to. 

My soon-to-be wife and I are both teachers.  We'll make a combined gross income of $81,000 next month.  We'll have to work three years to make $250,000.   If we could make that in one year, we'd be rich livin'. 

Granted, I don't think 250/yr is rich.  I'd call that comfortable.  You're able to support two kids, pay a mortgage (I'm curious how much), pay off loans, and plan for retirement.  You also do that with no credit card debt, and you stated that you're still saving money.  That's comfort. 

Rich is owning an extra house for vacations.  Rich is buying fancy bottles of wine at restaurants every week.  Rich is allowing your children to pick out whatever car they want AND buying it for them.  Rich is being able to invest enough money to not have to worry about an income. 

[Jumbo]

Yeah...  Marxism.

The party of feelings, class-warfare, envy and contempt is alive and well.  It's about wealth redistribution and get-even-with-em-ism.  The lower socio-economic classes will not do better because the higher classes are taxed more, but they'll feel better because higher wage earners will be penalized for their successes.  I heard it again today.  The average person who earns less than $50k per year works an average of 40 hours per week, while the average person who earns more than $100k per week works more than 70 hours per week.  People who work harder are just plain greedy! 

My boss didn't get the memo of a work week with only 40 hours

[Tiger Wench]

It depends on whom you are talking to. 

My soon-to-be wife and I are both teachers.  We'll make a combined gross income of $81,000 next month.  We'll have to work three years to make $250,000.   If we could make that in one year, we'd be rich livin'. 

Granted, I don't think 250/yr is rich.  I'd call that comfortable.  You're able to support two kids, pay a mortgage (I'm curious how much), pay off loans, and plan for retirement.  You also do that with no credit card debt, and you stated that you're still saving money.  That's comfort. 

Rich is owning an extra house for vacations.  Rich is buying fancy bottles of wine at restaurants every week.  Rich is allowing your children to pick out whatever car they want AND buying it for them.  Rich is being able to invest enough money to not have to worry about an income. 

We don't make $250K - but we are close enough to that for me to think that unless Obama totally fucks us over, we might see that figure during his term in office.  With the raise I just got, we will come close to $200K combined on our next tax return.  Our mortgage is $1300 a month.  I pay more than that in child care each month.  Both cars are paid for, but we are driving the wheels off of them in order to be able to save a down payment for the next round of new cars.  My 2003 Escape has over 100K on it - I have a long commute (distance wise, anyway). 

So yeah, i consider us to be comfortable, in that we bust our asses and live within our means to make sure we don't have any loans or debt other than the mortgage, but not so comfortable that we can even have a little bit of true luxury in our lives.  For example, we attend the occasional pro or college sporting event - beut we don't have season tickets.  The reason?  We have two college educations to save for, and that is a concern, given that Carl is already 46 and I am 38, and college and retirement will hit at exactly the same time.

So yeah, i get annoyed when someone tells me that once I hit that "magic number" that I will be taxed more to "share the wealth".  i dont' want to share the wealth!!!  I bust my ass for my paycheck, and giving it to some welfare mom so she can have a cell phone and fake nails is not my idea of a good time.  Neither is giving my money to support some stupid government program that will waste more money than it will actually spend in helping the so-called needy.   if I want to share the wealth, i do that through the charities I support and the volunteer work that I do - and yes, I do plenty of both.  But only for those causes I personally feel are a good use of my hard earned dollars. 

There's a good example of pro-choice - Pro-My Choice to decide who gets my money!!!

[Tarheel]

We don't make $250K - but we are close enough to that for me to think that unless Obama totally fucks us over, we might see that figure during his term in office.  With the raise I just got, we will come close to $200K combined on our next tax return. 
...

I think that you can safely count on that happening Tiger Wench; lord messiah The Obama is going to tax everything that moves or breathes (unless they currently don't pay any taxes in which case during his reign of terror they still won't but they may get more government handouts courtesy of you and I, et. al.)

"From each accoring to his ability to each according to his need"; might as well be the motto of the Democrats socialists.

[AUTiger1]

I think that you can safely count on that happening Tiger Wench; lord messiah The Obama is going to tax everything that moves or breathes (unless they currently don't pay any taxes in which case during his reign of terror they still won't but they may get more government handouts courtesy of you and I, et. al.)

"From each accoring to his ability to each according to his need"; might as well be the motto of the Democrats socialists.

The lovely Mrs. AUTiger1 is a 4th grade teacher, she is almost finished with her masters, so that means pay raise.  I am to receive an offer letter from a contractor here in Huntsvegas and it will mean about a 28% pay raise for myself.  I am dreading the first time we have to file taxes with the pay raise.  We will still be no where close to the $250K mark, hell, we won't even be close to the $150K mark, but we will still be doing pretty dang good.  I fear that "The One" is going to take most of it to pay for his and his cohorts spending habits.  Maybe the motto of the socialist should be "doing a "world" of good with your money". 

townhallsavoy: You pegged it with that line about being comfortable, no debt and being able to save, while paying normal bills  is the key. 

[Tarheel]

The lovely Mrs. AUTiger1 is a 4th grade teacher, she is almost finished with her masters, so that means pay raise.  I am to receive an offer letter from a contractor here in Huntsvegas and it will mean about a 28% pay raise for myself.  I am dreading the first time we have to file taxes with the pay raise.  We will still be no where close to the $250K mark, hell, we won't even be close to the $150K mark, but we will still be doing pretty dang good.  I fear that "The One" is going to take most of it to pay for his and his cohorts spending habits.  Maybe the motto of the socialist should be "doing a "world" of good with your money".
...

It's all about finding the right tax shelters...avoidance, that is...(not evasion...that would be illegal).

...
townhallsavoy: You pegged it with that line about being comfortable, no debt and being able to save, while paying normal bills  is the key. 

Sounds like you're going all Dave Ramsey on us here.

[AUTiger1]

Sounds like you're going all Dave Ramsey on us here.

I don't think Mr. Ramsey would like the fact that we don't budget for our bad habits and the trips out to eat if we don't feel like cooking.  I like his overall theme, but I call bullshit on some of his methods. 

[Kaos]

I don't think Mr. Ramsey would like the fact that we don't budget for our bad habits and the trips out to eat if we don't feel like cooking.  I like his overall theme, but I call bullshit on some of his methods. 

When Dave Ramsey tells me to drive a ramshackle car just because it's paid for when said car is almost CERTAIN to break down (breakdowns cost $$, dumbass) and clearly not as safe or efficient as a newer car I must finance (medical bills cost $$ dumbass), then Mr. Ramsey can kiss my ass. 

[AUTiger1]

When Dave Ramsey tells me to drive a ramshackle car just because it's paid for when said car is almost CERTAIN to break down (breakdowns cost $$, dumbass) and clearly not as safe or efficient as a newer car I must finance (medical bills cost $$ dumbass), then Mr. Ramsey can kiss my ass. 

Exactly, which is why I call bullshit on some of his methods.  He will also tell you to call the CC company and tell them that you have this much and will pay this much and work out a deal to only pay so much.  What he doesn't tell you is that they will put that on your credit report and it will take a hit.  Most people know this, but some don't and will do it.   I am pretty sure that he never clarifies that at his seminars when he tells the crowd that. 

[orangeandblue]

Another great thing about this board... republicans. Im in law school, have a few friends who are in med school. We were talking last night about the 250k limit. In the easiest of terms, what is anyones incentive to do better than 250k a year? What is a small businesses motivation to hire more people and grow? That 3k a year tax "credit" that the Dems are promising isnt going to do anything for the extra taxes that the small business guy will have to pay. Every element of his tax plan encourages people to be lazy, and takes money from the people who busted their ass to get ahead. There are plenty of people making under 250k who have worked hard, but isnt the American dream working hard, pushing yourself hard and getting ahead? Not waiting for someone to make their way and then "spread the wealth" to you. Im not in law school because my parents were lawyers, in fact, my dad is a hard working blue collar guy. But he worked hard so that I could get where I am, 2 degrees from AU and law school. We didnt ask for handouts or checks from the government, they busted ass and so did I. I will get off my rant... but its just good to see that I am not the only one who sees the insanity in this "tax plan."

[AUTailgatingRules]

Another great thing about this board... republicans. Im in law school, have a few friends who are in med school. We were talking last night about the 250k limit. In the easiest of terms, what is anyones incentive to do better than 250k a year? What is a small businesses motivation to hire more people and grow? That 3k a year tax "credit" that the Dems are promising isnt going to do anything for the extra taxes that the small business guy will have to pay. Every element of his tax plan encourages people to be lazy, and takes money from the people who busted their ass to get ahead. There are plenty of people making under 250k who have worked hard, but isnt the American dream working hard, pushing yourself hard and getting ahead? Not waiting for someone to make their way and then "spread the wealth" to you. Im not in law school because my parents were lawyers, in fact, my dad is a hard working blue collar guy. But he worked hard so that I could get where I am, 2 degrees from AU and law school. We didnt ask for handouts or checks from the government, they busted ass and so did I. I will get off my rant... but its just good to see that I am not the only one who sees the insanity in this "tax plan."

You know that you will be ostrisized from the law community if you ever openly espouse your Republican views.  I'm glad you see the light but be careful with all your lawyer buddies, you may get blackballed.

[orangeandblue]

I have learned that you have to walk the line. Listen to a lot of bullshit and nod your head when needed. But I would also rather stand on pinciple than fall on stupidity. Fortunately, I go to school in the south, and plan on staying somewhere in the south. So that helps, not much but it helps.

[Jumbo]

Another great thing about this board... republicans. Im in law school, have a few friends who are in med school. We were talking last night about the 250k limit. In the easiest of terms, what is anyones incentive to do better than 250k a year? What is a small businesses motivation to hire more people and grow? That 3k a year tax "credit" that the Dems are promising isnt going to do anything for the extra taxes that the small business guy will have to pay. Every element of his tax plan encourages people to be lazy, and takes money from the people who busted their ass to get ahead. There are plenty of people making under 250k who have worked hard, but isnt the American dream working hard, pushing yourself hard and getting ahead? Not waiting for someone to make their way and then "spread the wealth" to you. Im not in law school because my parents were lawyers, in fact, my dad is a hard working blue collar guy. But he worked hard so that I could get where I am, 2 degrees from AU and law school. We didnt ask for handouts or checks from the government, they busted ass and so did I. I will get off my rant... but its just good to see that I am not the only one who sees the insanity in this "tax plan."

I'm lazy can I borrow some money?