Who Goes? Who Stays? Who Sits?

RWS · « **Reply #60 on:** January 02, 2018, 10:10:55 AM »

Quote from: Buzz Killington on January 02, 2018, 08:36:53 AM

I hope Stidham decides to stay

An Auburn friend of mine and I were talking about this at work Sunday when we were discussing bowl games on NYD. Every year you see kids that have no business coming out early doing so. It's easy for us to say it's a bad decision, but I think they are steered by money, family, and just flat out naivety. I suppose some kids on the lower end of the skill spectrum see it as even if they get picked up as undrafted, they're still getting a check. With that said, in a sense, I think that it would be a mistake for Stidham to declare this year. I think that he has talent, but needs more polish. He needs to show that he can handle pressure better. Also, this year's QB class has been hyped beyond belief. Next year would be a much better scenario for him.

The problem with all of that is that Auburn loses most of the OL and some key pieces on defense next season. And then he has to overcome Malzahn's fuckery. He's taking a gamble that Malzahn can put together a cohesive team and give him an environment conducive to his development. This may be as high as his draft stock gets. It's a tough spot for him either way.

Buzz Killington · « **Reply #61 on:** January 02, 2018, 10:25:46 AM »

Quote from: RWS on January 02, 2018, 10:10:55 AM

An Auburn friend of mine and I were talking about this at work Sunday when we were discussing bowl games on NYD. Every year you see kids that have no business coming out early doing so. It's easy for us to say it's a bad decision, but I think they are steered by money, family, and just flat out naivety. I suppose some kids on the lower end of the skill spectrum see it as even if they get picked up as undrafted, they're still getting a check. With that said, in a sense, I think that it would be a mistake for Stidham to declare this year. I think that he has talent, but needs more polish. He needs to show that he can handle pressure better. Also, this year's QB class has been hyped beyond belief. Next year would be a much better scenario for him.

The problem with all of that is that Auburn loses most of the OL and some key pieces on defense next season. And then he has to overcome Malzahn's fudgeery. He's taking a gamble that Malzahn can put together a cohesive team and give him an environment conducive to his development. This may be as high as his draft stock gets. It's a tough spot for him either way.

That's a rather large gamble based on his track record.

Snaggletiger · « **Reply #62 on:** January 02, 2018, 10:42:27 AM »

Quote from: RWS on January 02, 2018, 10:10:55 AM

An Auburn friend of mine and I were talking about this at work Sunday when we were discussing bowl games on NYD. Every year you see kids that have no business coming out early doing so. It's easy for us to say it's a bad decision, but I think they are steered by money, family, and just flat out naivety. I suppose some kids on the lower end of the skill spectrum see it as even if they get picked up as undrafted, they're still getting a check. With that said, in a sense, I think that it would be a mistake for Stidham to declare this year. I think that he has talent, but needs more polish. He needs to show that he can handle pressure better. Also, this year's QB class has been hyped beyond belief. Next year would be a much better scenario for him.

The problem with all of that is that Auburn loses most of the OL and some key pieces on defense next season. And then he has to overcome Malzahn's fuckery. He's taking a gamble that Malzahn can put together a cohesive team and give him an environment conducive to his development. This may be as high as his draft stock gets. It's a tough spot for him either way.

I'm no Mel Kiper, but I don't see Stidham as anywhere near NFL ready. Not even close. He's got a great arm. As they say, "He spins it well". But yesterday was a prime example of why he's not ready. He flat out holds the ball too long. He had a big problem with it early in the season and yesterday, he reverted back to it and it really cost us.

You can say our receivers aren't getting open or our passing schemes aren't the greatest in the world. Maybe some of that is true. But it's almost like if the WR doesn't get 10 feet of separation, Stidham is not going to let it go. I heard some talk this morning on Golic & Wingo about whether Baker Mayfield would be a good NFL QB. Louis Riddick was saying the last TD pass he threw last night rolling to his left and squaring up his shoulders to fire off a pinpoint pass into a tight window was exhibit 1 as to why he has what it takes.

That's what you see in the NFL. Most passes are completed with a DB right there or draped all over the receiver. The next pass I throw in college or the NFL will be my first. But my armchair analysis sees JS as scared to trust the receiver or his own ability to put the ball where it needs to be when the WR has only a step on the defender. Instead, he holds it and waits.

Would love to hear WE!!!'s thoughts on it.

Buzz Killington · « **Reply #63 on:** January 02, 2018, 10:49:30 AM »

I am going to preface my next statement with this...I love Kodi Burns for his love of Auburn. However, having a guy that spent 11 games at WR as your WR coarch just doesn't seem very smart to me. It could be that Stidham holds onto the ball too long because there is noone out there that can get any kind of separation other than Will fucking Hastings, and that's only because he's elfin and can run a 3.9 second 40.

chinook · « **Reply #64 on:** January 02, 2018, 11:15:03 AM »

Quote from: Snaggletiger on January 02, 2018, 10:42:27 AM

Would love to hear WE!!!'s thoughts on it.

He's no Mel Kiper.

Godfather · « **Reply #65 on:** January 02, 2018, 11:37:22 AM »

Quote from: chinook on January 02, 2018, 11:15:03 AM

He's no Mel Kiper.

But he stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

chinook · « **Reply #66 on:** January 02, 2018, 11:55:08 AM »

Quote from: Godfather on January 02, 2018, 11:37:22 AM

But he stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

damn. Kim got him on a budget?

Snaggletiger · « **Reply #67 on:** January 02, 2018, 11:58:40 AM »

War Eagle!!! · « **Reply #68 on:** January 02, 2018, 01:11:26 PM »

I think Baker can make some good throws. The throw rolling to his left and hitting the guy in the back of the endzone was a thing of beauty. I thought he played brilliantly in the first half and dropped a couple of dimes to some covered up receivers. In the second half, he looked like shit. I'm not sure if it was because UGA cheap shotted him (like those fucking thugs always do) in the ribs, but he was off. I also know that OU needed to score a TD from the 25 yard line in OT to go to the National Championship game, and the Heisman trophy winning QB handed the ball off 3 times. This was after they had a 3rd and 2 in regulation on their own 45 and he threw a 30 yard wheel route. I'm not sure if that was on Baker or if somehow Malzahn hacked into the OU headsets to call plays.

As far as Stidham, it's hard to tell really. I thought the crap about Malzahn not being able to develop a good QB was just sort of BS. Now I am not really sure. Stidham seems to have the tools, but looked horrible yesterday. I have seen a couple of routes being run throughout the year where it looks like the WR is open, but Stidham doesn't pull the trigger. I don't get it. And I have no idea whether it's Stidham just not getting the job done or Malzahn not getting the job done. The two INT's yesterday were horrible. The last one especially is inexcusable. That was the biggest give up bullshit I have ever seen...

War Eagle!!! · « **Reply #69 on:** January 02, 2018, 01:13:58 PM »

Quote from: Buzz Killington on January 02, 2018, 10:49:30 AM

I am going to preface my next statement with this...I love Kodi Burns for his love of Auburn. However, having a guy that spent 11 games at WR as your WR coarch just doesn't seem very smart to me. It could be that Stidham holds onto the ball too long because there is noone out there that can get any kind of separation other than Will fucking Hastings, and that's only because he's elfin and can run a 3.9 second 40.

I know I took a video at some point and texted it to a group of yall, but I saw stidham stare down a slant in one of the games this year, where the WR broke free in the zone coverage and no one was around him. Stidham pumped but couldn't pull the trigger. I'm not sure this is all on the WR or the WR coach.

CCTAU · « **Reply #70 on:** January 02, 2018, 01:15:12 PM »

Quote from: Buzz Killington on January 02, 2018, 10:49:30 AM

Will fucking Hastings, and that's only because he's elfin and can run a 3.9 second 40.

True dat!

I'm not sure the guy will ever be able to "throw a WR open"...

CCTAU · « **Reply #71 on:** January 02, 2018, 01:24:59 PM »

Quote from: War Eagle!!! on January 02, 2018, 01:11:26 PM

And I have no idea whether it's Stidham just not getting the job done or Malzahn not getting the job done. The two INT's yesterday were horrible. The last one especially is inexcusable. That was the biggest give up bullshit I have ever seen...

I'm not sure you can coach vision. It has to be in you. or learned. Right now, Stidham has NO vision if the play breaks down.

On the next to last play, he scrambled left and threw the ball OOBs. If you look right about teh numbers, you see NCM change direction heading back to the middle of the field. Left his guy standing still. Stidham throws it OOBs. No vision.

I think for our offense to work, Stidham will need to go live in practice and the offense will need to run as fast as they can. The offense as whole seems a step slow mentally. Especially Stidham.

If Stidham leave3s, I won't cry. Maybe then we get back to Malzahn's addiction to the option. 2013 ruined him. He tasted that football heroin and cannot get past it!

War Eagle!!! · « **Reply #72 on:** January 02, 2018, 04:26:26 PM »

Quote from: CCTAU on January 02, 2018, 01:24:59 PM

I'm not sure you can coach vision. It has to be in you. or learned. Right now, Stidham has NO vision if the play breaks down.

Not sure the difference in "coached" and "learned", but I absolutely think you can tell a QB where to throw the ball expecting where the WR is going to be given a certain coverage. That's high school level shit...much less DI SEC ball...

Snaggletiger · « **Reply #73 on:** January 02, 2018, 05:13:00 PM »

Quote from: War Eagle!!! on January 02, 2018, 04:26:26 PM

Not sure the difference in "coached" and "learned", but I absolutely think you can tell a QB where to throw the ball expecting where the WR is going to be given a certain coverage. That's high school level shit...much less DI SEC ball...

What you said above in a previous post is what I was thinking. Receivers may be open but Stidham won't pull the trigger. You don't have to be able to drive a car between the WR and DB for him to be open. Again, I'm not trying to suggest that JS be on the level of top flight NFL QB's. It's just that you watch those guys and all it takes is that split second when he sees that his receiver simply has inside position on the DB and he lets it fly.

I know there was some question as to whether Malzahn wanted his QB's working with outside trainers. Didn't White or one of them work with someone last year or the year before. I obviously know exactly squat about coaching a QB. But it seems to me that a professional QB coach or trainer could get with JS and work on recognition and quick release. Teach him to trust that if his receiver is in a certain position with relation to the DB, he's open. Turn it loose.

The Prowler · « **Reply #74 on:** January 02, 2018, 06:29:48 PM »

Kerryon is entering the Draft, kinda figured that.

Snaggletiger · « **Reply #75 on:** January 02, 2018, 10:01:18 PM »

Quote from: The Prowler on January 02, 2018, 06:29:48 PM

Kerryon is entering the Draft, kinda figured that.

I think Holland and C. Davis will be the only other two. Maybe Pettway, but that being more a result of an uncertain future at AU.

So I ask again, should it be a priority for this staff to target a big time back with the slots we have left in this class? If Pettway is done, we may be in a world of hurt at RB if they don't go flip a 4*-5* or sign a top rated JUCO.

The Prowler · « **Reply #76 on:** January 02, 2018, 10:04:57 PM »

Quote from: Snaggletiger on January 02, 2018, 10:01:18 PM

I think Holland and C. Davis will be the only other two. Maybe Pettway, but that being more a result of an uncertain future at AU.

So I ask again, should it be a priority for this staff to target a big time back with the slots we have left in this class? If Pettway is done, we may be in a world of hurt at RB if they don't go flip a 4*-5* or sign a top rated JUCO.

I'd go the JUCO route if any are available (looking at the Top 100 there aren't any)...bring in a "ground pounder" that can carry the ball 35 times a game on straight dive plays and get stronger as the game goes on. Of course we'll likely never know if a player like Malik Miller could be that guy, because apparently zero evaluations are done before the season starts and that usually carries on to around the 3rd or 4th game of the upcoming season.

Snaggletiger · « **Reply #77 on:** January 02, 2018, 10:21:23 PM »

Quote from: The Prowler on January 02, 2018, 10:04:57 PM

I'd go the JUCO route...bring in a "ground pounder" that can carry the ball 35 times a game on straight dive plays and get stronger as the game goes on.

I'd love to see that too. Not to pile on Malzahn again, but I just worry about his usage of backs. As much as I hate UGA, I give Smart credit for realizing he's got a stable of studs back there and they distribute the carries. Obviously, Chubb and Meeshell get the majority of the totes, but they still mix in a couple of others throughout the game and give them some touches. My worry is right now, we have Malik Miller at 225. Everyone else is 185-200, including incoming freshman, Asa Martin. That won't cut it in this league. As good as Kerryon was at times, he was still only 205 at most and stayed beat up for 3 years. Did the Smoke kid commit anywhere?

Godfather · « **Reply #78 on:** January 03, 2018, 12:29:26 AM »

Quote from: Snaggletiger on January 02, 2018, 10:21:23 PM

I'd love to see that too. Not to pile on Malzahn again, but I just worry about his usage of backs. As much as I hate UGA, I give Smart credit for realizing he's got a stable of studs back there and they distribute the carries. Obviously, Chubb and Meeshell get the majority of the totes, but they still mix in a couple of others throughout the game and give them some touches. My worry is right now, we have Malik Miller at 225. Everyone else is 185-200, including incoming freshman, Asa Martin. That won't cut it in this league. As good as Kerryon was at times, he was still only 205 at most and stayed beat up for 3 years. Did the Smoke kid commit anywhere?

Assuming Pettway is gonzo, returning would be:
Kam Martin (5-10, 182)
Malik Miller (5-11, 225)
Devan Barrett (6-0, 185)
WR turned RB JaTarvious Whitlow (6-0, 215) turned heads at bowl practice I heard. Course that will, mean dick I'm sure.

Signees
Asa Martin (5-11, 200)
Shaun Shivers (5-7, 169)

jmar · « **Reply #79 on:** January 03, 2018, 01:08:36 AM »

Joiner still up for the highest bidder. Smoke still out there but getting more attention from State and USCe.

When Malzahn stops thinking he's Schembechler and Lindsey can do his thing Stidham will work well within our offense.
I only care about his place as an Auburn QB. Couldn't give a shit less if he ever "develops" into a pro. MOST NEVER WILL!
Easy to single out a player or deflect from the real problem which is Malzahn.

Malzahn/Stidham bad.
Lindsey/Stidham good.

Why is this so fucking hard for people to understand?
Is it because we need a fall guy, or one that will eventually leave?
No...the real problem is we refuse to admit that we are fucking locked-in for well over a decade with Gus. I will be eating goddamned cat food by the time Malzahn hangs it up at Auburn.