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Beerz At JHS?

Snaggletiger

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Beerz At JHS?
« on: April 26, 2017, 10:00:03 AM »
Curious to know what the semi-honest opinions are about the possibility of alcohol being served at the foosball games.  I think the last I saw from SEC Commish Sankey was a complete straddling of the fence.  "The policy is no alcohol in general admission seating areas but we'll have conversations about it....".  As I mentioned, they were selling in the scholarship sections at A-Day and I was told it kind of experimental at this point.

But, would you be in favor of it?

Admittedly, I was stoked to have a couple of beerz at A-Day.  And yes, it's a rare occasion that my cargo shorts pockets aren't clinking on the way in to JHS, filled with various and sundry brands of bourbon in search of a stadium cup filled with Delicious Coke Product. But the other side of that was this past Saturday night.

Granted, Saturday was a much different event (Country concert + Lynyrd Skynyrd) and probably a little different crowd than would normally be at JHS, but not that different.  A ton of young folks.  GF's perspective may have been a little different than mine, being that he was on the stadium floor in the VIP section.  But from where I sat, it was not a good look.  There were some seriously fucked up, falling down drunk people.  I'm not talking one or two that you pointed and laughed at.  I mean all over that place. The cops even came down to the section next to us and pulled a young guy out.  Apparently, his drunk ass knocked the hell out of a girl on the row in front of him.

However, the key might be in how they serve it if in fact alcohol sales do come to pass.  They were in your face with it Saturday.  I can't recall a time during that entire concert that there wasn't at least one beer salesman on our row.  And they were still selling it during the last act.

Would you like to see it in Jordan-Hare?  What say you?   
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wesfau2

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Re: Beerz At JHS?
« Reply #1 on: April 26, 2017, 10:31:16 AM »
Yes, sell that shit.

Irresponsible drinkers are always going to be a problem at a big event...doubly so when the tradition is to binge heavily prior to the event.

So what?  Cut 'em off, drag out the unruly and let the adults be adults.

This decision will, like almost every other SEC decision, be made by the $$.  They can make a metric fuckton of money selling beer to college football fans.
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AUChizad

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Re: Beerz At JHS?
« Reply #2 on: April 26, 2017, 10:40:49 AM »
Yes, sell that shit.

Irresponsible drinkers are always going to be a problem at a big event...doubly so when the tradition is to binge heavily prior to the event.

So what?  Cut 'em off, drag out the unruly and let the adults be adults.

This decision will, like almost every other SEC decision, be made by the $$.  They can make a metric fuckton of money selling beer to college football fans.
This is my libertarianism speaking, but I would bet dollars to donuts that selling booze would not only raise money, but DECREASE the out-of-control drunkenness in the stadium. Right now, the standard is to sneak your own hard liquor into the stadium. Selling beers or even cocktails at a premium will eliminate that black market and will most likely result in more restraint.
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WiregrassTiger

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Re: Beerz At JHS?
« Reply #3 on: April 26, 2017, 11:10:08 AM »
Absolutely NO.

No way this is a good idea. Chizzy and Wes are on the same side as usual, so that should be enough to prove it's a bad idea.
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Snaggletiger

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Re: Beerz At JHS?
« Reply #4 on: April 26, 2017, 11:41:15 AM »
This is my libertarianism speaking, but I would bet dollars to donuts that selling booze would not only raise money, but DECREASE the out-of-control drunkenness in the stadium. Right now, the standard is to sneak your own hard liquor into the stadium. Selling beers or even cocktails at a premium will eliminate that black market and will most likely result in more restraint.

Again, it's all about how they handle the sales in my opinion. At last year's concert, they had kiosks set up in the concourse and a couple out on the stadium floor.  You normally waited in a long line for an $8.00 16oz'r.  Not the case this year.  Same kiosks set up, but a walking beer vendor also readily available from start to finish.  Always one on the stairs by our section and as I said, there were some trashed individuals.

One thing Snagette and I kept cracking up at were 4 women, two of which were in the rumblin', bumblin', stumblin' mode early on.  Every time they'd go to the bathroom or concessions, they'd all get up together and walk up and down the stairs like a kindergarten class on a field trip.  Straight line with a hand on the shoulder of the person in front of you.  It was the only way to keep a couple of them from face planting.     
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Re: Beerz At JHS?
« Reply #5 on: April 26, 2017, 12:17:00 PM »
Absolutely NO.

No way this is a good idea. Chizzy and Wes are on the same side as usual, so that should be enough to prove it's a bad idea.

We are on the same side.  Validating the correctness of our shared opinion.

I echo your absolutely and inject an unequivocally and emphatically.
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Kaos

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Re: Beerz At JHS?
« Reply #6 on: April 26, 2017, 12:22:04 PM »
This is my libertarianism speaking, but I would bet dollars to donuts that selling booze would not only raise money, but DECREASE the out-of-control drunkenness in the stadium. Right now, the standard is to sneak your own hard liquor into the stadium. Selling beers or even cocktails at a premium will eliminate that black market and will most likely result in more restraint.

I'm really sick of this bogus argument.  It's a falsehood.

Make heroin legal and we will have fewer overdoses!  Make abortion legal so people stop using coat hangers.

It's bullshit. Evidence does not bear this argument out. Never will.

If you two want beer poured on you and drunk fuckholes bellowing near you go to Tuscaloosa, Talladega or an NFL game. Not Auburn.
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AUTailgatingRules

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Re: Beerz At JHS?
« Reply #7 on: April 26, 2017, 01:18:28 PM »
I'm in the don't really care either way camp.  I just hope they don't sell it in the regular concession stands.  The lines are already close to unbearable.  Imagine having to pour beer on top of all else.
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Snaggletiger

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Re: Beerz At JHS?
« Reply #8 on: April 26, 2017, 02:10:53 PM »
I'm in the don't really care either way camp.  I just hope they don't sell it in the regular concession stands.  The lines are already close to unbearable.  Imagine having to pour beer on top of all else.

In the two concerts, they weren't selling it in the regular concessions.  SodixaHo wasn't passing out any brewski's.  They had numerous stations out in the concourse.
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wesfau2

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Re: Beerz At JHS?
« Reply #9 on: April 26, 2017, 04:10:04 PM »
I'm really sick of this bogus argument.  It's a falsehood.

Make heroin legal and we will have fewer overdoses!  Make abortion legal so people stop using coat hangers.

It's bullshit. Evidence does not bear this argument out. Never will.


Maybe too early to declare victory on the heroin front, but your abortion argument position is totally false. 
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AUChizad

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Re: Beerz At JHS?
« Reply #10 on: April 26, 2017, 04:17:30 PM »
Maybe too early to declare victory on the heroin front, but your abortion argument position is totally false.
Evidence actually does bear out both cases. He's wrong, but at this point pointing it out is like pointing out the sun is rising.

http://www.vox.com/2016/9/15/12915200/canada-heroin-injection-site
https://news.vice.com/article/ungass-portugal-what-happened-after-decriminalization-drugs-weed-to-heroin
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Snaggletiger

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Re: Beerz At JHS?
« Reply #11 on: April 26, 2017, 04:19:11 PM »
Interesting piece I found from this past September addressing some of the points made here.  From insidehighered.com


Ohio State University football fans attending the first home game of the season earlier this month saw a new concession item on the menu at Ohio Stadium. Among the hot dogs, pretzels and tacos, the game’s attendees were also able to buy cans of Miller Lite.

This season, Ohio State became one of several universities to sell beer at football games. In the last decade, alcohol sales at college stadiums have gone from nearly nonexistent to an increasingly popular -- though largely unproven -- solution for programs hoping to improve sagging attendance at home games.

West Virginia University started offering beer at its stadium’s concession stands in 2011, and the idea has snowballed from there. Fans can now drink beer -- and in many cases, wine -- in the stands at the Universities of Cincinnati, Colorado at Boulder, Florida, Louisville, Maryland, Miami, Minnesota, Texas at Austin, and Toledo. Beer is also for sale at Syracuse University, Southern Methodist University and the University of Houston, among many others.

Pennsylvania State University is considering selling beer to general admission fans, and so are the University of Wyoming and Indiana University. Washington State University wants to sell beer at football games but is waiting on the state’s liquor board to approve the change. Unable to sell beer inside its stadium because of Southeastern Conference rules, Louisiana State University is exploring plans to create a beer garden just outside the stadium gates. The University of Pittsburgh started selling beer at its football games this season, as did the University of Tulsa.

“We studied the idea for a year,” said Don Tomkalski, associate athletics director for communications at Tulsa. “And we determined that it could be done responsibility and be a positive change. It gives us an additional revenue source and adds another element to our game-day fan experience.”

Worried about the binge drinking, disorderly behavior and violence that can come with consuming alcohol, most colleges have long been opposed to selling beer at football games. A study published in January by the National Bureau of Economic Research found a 28 percent increase in rape reports by college-age women on days when Football Bowl Subdivision teams play. Earlier research has found that arrests for driving while intoxicated also increase on college game days.

Those concerns haven't been limited to football games. In 1964, the National Collegiate Athletic Association barred beer sales at the College World Series for baseball. The ban lasted until this summer, when NCAA officials decided to allow beer and wine to be sold once again in an attempt to draw in more fans.

The same logic is driving the changes in college football. A decade ago, most college sports fans looking to down a beer while watching their team had to stay at home or go to a bar. And many did just that. Last year, according to the NCAA, attendance at Football Bowl Subdivision home games averaged about 43,000 people. In the mid-2000s, FBS home games averaged about 46,000 people.

“One of the conversations we’ve been having the past few years is about how we can compete with other fan experiences,” said Jack Miner, director of operations at Ohio State’s registrar office and a member of the university’s athletic council. “Being in Columbus, Ohio, we’re not competing against professional sports teams, but locations where someone can go watch a game. Very frequently we were losing attendance to people staying at home or watching from a bar.”

Improving the “fan experience” has been a common concern among athletic departments in recent years, leading to college stadiums offering in-stadium instant replay, over-the-top halftime shows and increasingly sophisticated concessions menus.

So far, it’s unclear if selling alcohol has actually helped boost attendance. Anecdotally, university officials say they see more fans attending games and staying in the stands longer. But a paper published in the Journal of Sports Economics last year, which studied attendance at 29 midmajor football programs from 2005 to 2012, found “no evidence” of such a correlation.

As an additional form of revenue, though, selling beer at games seems to be working. West Virginia University has received more than $3 million in revenue from alcohol sales since it began selling beer in 2011. Ohio State and Tulsa, which both began to offer alcohol in their stadiums this season, said it’s too early to offer concrete numbers, but that they expect to see high returns on the investment.

So many people lined up for beer at Ohio State’s first game of the season that one angry fan wrote to the local newspaper, bemoaning the concession stands’ sudden popularity. “I am sure the university made a lot of money on the sale of beer,” the fan wrote. “It had to, because the lines were horrendous.”

The university said it plans on using $600,000 of the new revenue to hire and train four new campus police officers. Another $50,000 will go toward university research on alcohol consumption. Ohio State, West Virginia and other colleges that now offer beer during games all say that revenue and attendance are not the only reasons for the change, however. They said there’s a safety component, too.

“One of the things we saw consistently when talking to schools that tried beer sales, is that it began changing fan behavior,” Miner said. “We heard a lot of feedback that fans don’t feel the pressure to drink and preload before entering the stadium. There’s no longer that pressure to chug a few beers while tailgating because you know you can’t drink anymore once you’re inside the stadium.”

It’s too early to say for certain that the experiment has led to less intoxicated fans at Ohio State, but the university suggested that it could be having an effect on fan behavior. In the 2015 season opener, 10 fans were ejected from the stadium, which was on par with the season average of 12 ejections. Only two fans were ejected by stadium security at this season's first game.

West Virginia officials, as well, have reported a “sharp decline” in security incidents during home games. Bob Roberts, the university’s chief of police, said that’s the result of not only selling beer in the stadium but also a series of other precautions the university adopted. Fans can no longer re-enter the stadium if they exit before a game is over, for example, and the university started a campaign called High Five Rules, which encourages students and other fans to “engage in proper behavior.” That includes no excessive drinking.

“We had a reputation as being a pretty bad place to come if you were a visiting team, and I think alcohol was a part of that,” Roberts said. “The beer sales have had an effect on binge drinking before games. As chief of police, if someone said, ‘Hey, we want to sell beer, but not do these extra things,’ I would have said ‘nope, I’m not supporting that.’ But for us, it was a part of an overall strategy for improving safety in our stadium.”

Aaron White, the program director of college and underage drinking prevention at the National Institute on Alcohol Abuse and Alcoholism, said he is skeptical of beer sales being able to reduce game-day drinking.

The University of Colorado at Boulder, citing drunken and violent behavior of fans, banned drinking in its football stadium from 1996 to 2014. A 2010 study about the university, published in the Journal of American College Health, found that “arrests, assaults, ejections and student referrals to the judicial affairs office all fell dramatically after the ban on beer sales” went into effect.

“Selling alcohol at sporting events is not a prevention strategy,” White said. “It’s a tricky issue, but the logic that allowing alcohol sales inside stadiums will decrease game-day drinking is dubious at best.”
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Kaos

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Re: Beerz At JHS?
« Reply #12 on: April 26, 2017, 05:32:27 PM »
Evidence actually does bear out both cases. He's wrong, but at this point pointing it out is like pointing out the sun is rising.

http://www.vox.com/2016/9/15/12915200/canada-heroin-injection-site
https://news.vice.com/article/ungass-portugal-what-happened-after-decriminalization-drugs-weed-to-heroin

 :taunt:

And I can show you any amount of "studies" shitting on your opinion.
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Kaos

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Re: Beerz At JHS?
« Reply #13 on: April 26, 2017, 05:36:18 PM »
Interesting piece I found from this past September addressing some of the points made here.  From insidehighered.com


Ohio State University football fans attending the first home game of the season earlier this month saw a new concession item on the menu at Ohio Stadium. Among the hot dogs, pretzels and tacos, the game’s attendees were also able to buy cans of Miller Lite.

This season, Ohio State became one of several universities to sell beer at football games. In the last decade, alcohol sales at college stadiums have gone from nearly nonexistent to an increasingly popular -- though largely unproven -- solution for programs hoping to improve sagging attendance at home games.

West Virginia University started offering beer at its stadium’s concession stands in 2011, and the idea has snowballed from there. Fans can now drink beer -- and in many cases, wine -- in the stands at the Universities of Cincinnati, Colorado at Boulder, Florida, Louisville, Maryland, Miami, Minnesota, Texas at Austin, and Toledo. Beer is also for sale at Syracuse University, Southern Methodist University and the University of Houston, among many others.

Pennsylvania State University is considering selling beer to general admission fans, and so are the University of Wyoming and Indiana University. Washington State University wants to sell beer at football games but is waiting on the state’s liquor board to approve the change. Unable to sell beer inside its stadium because of Southeastern Conference rules, Louisiana State University is exploring plans to create a beer garden just outside the stadium gates. The University of Pittsburgh started selling beer at its football games this season, as did the University of Tulsa.

“We studied the idea for a year,” said Don Tomkalski, associate athletics director for communications at Tulsa. “And we determined that it could be done responsibility and be a positive change. It gives us an additional revenue source and adds another element to our game-day fan experience.”

Worried about the binge drinking, disorderly behavior and violence that can come with consuming alcohol, most colleges have long been opposed to selling beer at football games. A study published in January by the National Bureau of Economic Research found a 28 percent increase in rape reports by college-age women on days when Football Bowl Subdivision teams play. Earlier research has found that arrests for driving while intoxicated also increase on college game days.

Those concerns haven't been limited to football games. In 1964, the National Collegiate Athletic Association barred beer sales at the College World Series for baseball. The ban lasted until this summer, when NCAA officials decided to allow beer and wine to be sold once again in an attempt to draw in more fans.

The same logic is driving the changes in college football. A decade ago, most college sports fans looking to down a beer while watching their team had to stay at home or go to a bar. And many did just that. Last year, according to the NCAA, attendance at Football Bowl Subdivision home games averaged about 43,000 people. In the mid-2000s, FBS home games averaged about 46,000 people.

“One of the conversations we’ve been having the past few years is about how we can compete with other fan experiences,” said Jack Miner, director of operations at Ohio State’s registrar office and a member of the university’s athletic council. “Being in Columbus, Ohio, we’re not competing against professional sports teams, but locations where someone can go watch a game. Very frequently we were losing attendance to people staying at home or watching from a bar.”

Improving the “fan experience” has been a common concern among athletic departments in recent years, leading to college stadiums offering in-stadium instant replay, over-the-top halftime shows and increasingly sophisticated concessions menus.

So far, it’s unclear if selling alcohol has actually helped boost attendance. Anecdotally, university officials say they see more fans attending games and staying in the stands longer. But a paper published in the Journal of Sports Economics last year, which studied attendance at 29 midmajor football programs from 2005 to 2012, found “no evidence” of such a correlation.

As an additional form of revenue, though, selling beer at games seems to be working. West Virginia University has received more than $3 million in revenue from alcohol sales since it began selling beer in 2011. Ohio State and Tulsa, which both began to offer alcohol in their stadiums this season, said it’s too early to offer concrete numbers, but that they expect to see high returns on the investment.

So many people lined up for beer at Ohio State’s first game of the season that one angry fan wrote to the local newspaper, bemoaning the concession stands’ sudden popularity. “I am sure the university made a lot of money on the sale of beer,” the fan wrote. “It had to, because the lines were horrendous.”

The university said it plans on using $600,000 of the new revenue to hire and train four new campus police officers. Another $50,000 will go toward university research on alcohol consumption. Ohio State, West Virginia and other colleges that now offer beer during games all say that revenue and attendance are not the only reasons for the change, however. They said there’s a safety component, too.

“One of the things we saw consistently when talking to schools that tried beer sales, is that it began changing fan behavior,” Miner said. “We heard a lot of feedback that fans don’t feel the pressure to drink and preload before entering the stadium. There’s no longer that pressure to chug a few beers while tailgating because you know you can’t drink anymore once you’re inside the stadium.”

It’s too early to say for certain that the experiment has led to less intoxicated fans at Ohio State, but the university suggested that it could be having an effect on fan behavior. In the 2015 season opener, 10 fans were ejected from the stadium, which was on par with the season average of 12 ejections. Only two fans were ejected by stadium security at this season's first game.

West Virginia officials, as well, have reported a “sharp decline” in security incidents during home games. Bob Roberts, the university’s chief of police, said that’s the result of not only selling beer in the stadium but also a series of other precautions the university adopted. Fans can no longer re-enter the stadium if they exit before a game is over, for example, and the university started a campaign called High Five Rules, which encourages students and other fans to “engage in proper behavior.” That includes no excessive drinking.

“We had a reputation as being a pretty bad place to come if you were a visiting team, and I think alcohol was a part of that,” Roberts said. “The beer sales have had an effect on binge drinking before games. As chief of police, if someone said, ‘Hey, we want to sell beer, but not do these extra things,’ I would have said ‘nope, I’m not supporting that.’ But for us, it was a part of an overall strategy for improving safety in our stadium.”

Aaron White, the program director of college and underage drinking prevention at the National Institute on Alcohol Abuse and Alcoholism, said he is skeptical of beer sales being able to reduce game-day drinking.

The University of Colorado at Boulder, citing drunken and violent behavior of fans, banned drinking in its football stadium from 1996 to 2014. A 2010 study about the university, published in the Journal of American College Health, found that “arrests, assaults, ejections and student referrals to the judicial affairs office all fell dramatically after the ban on beer sales” went into effect.

“Selling alcohol at sporting events is not a prevention strategy,” White said. “It’s a tricky issue, but the logic that allowing alcohol sales inside stadiums will decrease game-day drinking is dubious at best.”

This is so much bullshit. If you can't get fans to come to your game because they can't last four fucking hours without soaking themselves in booze?  Fuck your fans. Build a smaller stadium.
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WiregrassTiger

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Re: Beerz At JHS?
« Reply #14 on: April 26, 2017, 06:10:58 PM »
There is enough issues with drunks and smokers as it is.

I'll admit, I've been drunk as a coot in JHS but only once. I've drank a number of times but I'm more interested in football than drink when I'm there.

I hate smoking in JHS. Used to smoke myself but can't tolerate it now. Literally makes me queasy to smell. Hate walking by smokers at the gates or on the ramp, etc. and sometimes I've seen drunks light up in the stadium. Selling beer will only make it worse.

I may as well face it. We are like a minor league team for the NFL. Losing traditions and identity faster than I can handle.
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Snaggletiger

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Re: Beerz At JHS?
« Reply #15 on: April 26, 2017, 08:20:22 PM »
There is enough issues with drunks and smokers as it is.

I'll admit, I've been drunk as a coot in JHS but only once. I've drank a number of times but I'm more interested in football than drink when I'm there.

I hate smoking in JHS. Used to smoke myself but can't tolerate it now. Literally makes me queasy to smell. Hate walking by smokers at the gates or on the ramp, etc. and sometimes I've seen drunks light up in the stadium. Selling beer will only make it worse.

I may as well face it. We are like a minor league team for the NFL. Losing traditions and identity faster than I can handle.

I think most of them hate you like Dallas. 

To be fair, it sounds like the alcohol thing is still just a possibility and probably pretty far off, if it happens at all.  But if Jay thinks it will bring in more JJ Bucks, it's more likely than not.
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Pell City Tiger

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Re: Beerz At JHS?
« Reply #16 on: April 26, 2017, 09:34:25 PM »
I'll bare knuckle fight anyone in defense of my cigar and whiskey, Sonic parking lot or not. Come at me.
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Snaggletiger

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Re: Beerz At JHS?
« Reply #17 on: April 26, 2017, 10:00:41 PM »
I'll bare knuckle fight anyone in defense of my cigar and whiskey, Sonic parking lot or not. Come at me.

Marquess of Queensbury Rules in the Sonic Parking lot?

I would thrash you, simpleton.
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Re: Beerz At JHS?
« Reply #18 on: April 27, 2017, 08:03:42 AM »
I'll bare knuckle fight anyone in defense of my cigar and whiskey, Sonic parking lot or not. Come at me.
I can withstand cigar smoke better than Winstons. But you're not smoking in the stands anyway.

Although I don't think the rules apply to Chief any way.
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Re: Beerz At JHS?
« Reply #19 on: April 27, 2017, 09:08:04 AM »
I'm with tailgating on this, I'm neither for nor against.  I would probably still sneak it in to avoid lining Jays pockets further.
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