The Magic Murder Kingdom

[Godfather]

Wounded Knee would like a word.

Do arrows count?

[GH2001]

The coward went to the gun shop 3 times shortly before the massacre.  He bought a Sig Sauer .223 Assault Rifle and a Glock 17.  After reading up on that assault rifle, I can easily see how dozens were killed pretty quick.  Question for the gun enthusiasts:

I'm a gun owner myself.  Used to do a lot of hunting years ago and owned everything from a .22 to a 7 mm.  I fully believe in our right to bear arms...bear arms sounds like we're going to war....own guns.  And I also fully believe that if guns were taken away, guys like this would simply do what his cowardly brethren (And let's not forget that we have our own collection of cooks here in America) in the Middle East do on a daily basis.  Fill a car with explosives and blow it up in a crowded place.  Or strap them to his own body and press the button and look for his 72 virgins.

But, I'm honestly starting to question the reason that weapons like this are readily available to the public.  Especially someone that's been under FBI investigation not once, but twice.  I understand owning guns for hunting, skeet shooting, recreational shooting and obviously, protection.  But what's the purpose of the average citizen owning assault rifles?  Is it just a rush to shoot them?  Schoolify me on the subject.

Just a couple of things because I'm weird and these things perturb me:

- assault rifle has been purposely given a bad connotation for political reasons. All it is is a gun that is semi in nature (one trigger pull, one bullet fired)  and rifled.

- AR as in "AR15 .223" like the one used - does NOT stand for assault rifle. It's is armalite rifle.

- assault "weapon" is an invented term by anti gun lobbyists and legislators circa 1994 with clintons awb. It expired during bushs term and they (Feinstein and her Ilk) have been trying to pass another ever since. The 94 bill did nothing good statistically.

[dallaswareagle]

Just a couple of things because I'm weird and these things perturb me:

- assault rifle has been purposely given a bad connotation for political reasons. All it is is a gun that is semi in nature (one trigger pull, one bullet fired)  and rifled.

- AR as in "AR15 .223" like the one used - does NOT stand for assault rifle. It's is armalite rifle.

- assault "weapon" is an invented term by anti gun lobbyists and legislators circa 1994 with clintons awb. It expired during bushs term and they (Feinstein and her Ilk) have been trying to pass another ever since. The 94 bill did nothing good statistically.

And to a point, all weapons when used wrongly are assault weapons.   Here in Tejas, we have a lot of folks carrying weapons. They have gun free zones here that are not enforceable, (Stores, restaurants and such) I can almost guess that  if I am in a place and I see 10 people at least 4 are carrying. ( I know one is)

[Saniflush]

Do arrows count?

Only through the heart.

[GH2001]

And to a point, all weapons when used wrongly are assault weapons.   Here in Tejas, we have a lot of folks carrying weapons. They have gun free zones here that are not enforceable, (Stores, restaurants and such) I can almost guess that  if I am in a place and I see 10 people at least 4 are carrying. ( I know one is)

It's nice living in a part of the country where concealed carry is not frowned upon. They tend to be responsible people. It's the open carry idiots that give gun owners a bad name. No reason a redneck needs to go into an eating establishment and place an Ak on the table fully loaded. It's purely a head issue they have. Concealed is safe and gets the job done.

[Snaggletiger]

I get the whole "Guns don't kill people..." argument.  Agree with it.  And I'll take my chances with our government not overthrowing the republic.  That ain't happening.  I may eventually move to a Caribbean island when idiot policies like Obama Care hit too hard or the guilt from my white privilege becomes too much for me to bear.  But there will never be a time when I'm taking my family and my guns and heading to the woods to avoid getting kilt by my own police or military.  Not gonna' waste one minute of time worrying or even thinking about it.

[Token]

The coward went to the gun shop 3 times shortly before the massacre.  He bought a Sig Sauer .223 Assault Rifle and a Glock 17.  After reading up on that assault rifle, I can easily see how dozens were killed pretty quick.  Question for the gun enthusiasts:

I'm a gun owner myself.  Used to do a lot of hunting years ago and owned everything from a .22 to a 7 mm.  I fully believe in our right to bear arms...bear arms sounds like we're going to war....own guns.  And I also fully believe that if guns were taken away, guys like this would simply do what his cowardly brethren (And let's not forget that we have our own collection of cooks here in America) in the Middle East do on a daily basis.  Fill a car with explosives and blow it up in a crowded place.  Or strap them to his own body and press the button and look for his 72 virgins.

But, I'm honestly starting to question the reason that weapons like this are readily available to the public.  Especially someone that's been under FBI investigation not once, but twice.  I understand owning guns for hunting, skeet shooting, recreational shooting and obviously, protection.  But what's the purpose of the average citizen owning assault rifles?  Is it just a rush to shoot them?  Schoolify me on the subject.

For the record, a .30-06 scares me as much or more than an AR-15.  A man ready to kill, with a plan, behind a scoped .30-06 is terrifying thought.  Asshole in a crowded room of people not willing to fight between mag changes is easy pickings, no doubt. But he could have did the same amount of killing with ANY firearm in those circumstances. 

[dallaswareagle]

It's nice living in a part of the country where concealed carry is not frowned upon. They tend to be responsible people. It's the open carry idiots that give gun owners a bad name. No reason a redneck needs to go into an eating establishment and place an Ak on the table fully loaded. It's purely a head issue they have. Concealed is safe and gets the job done.

Yea, those folks worry me, its like they are looking for a gun fight. And not once in their life have they ever had a round go over their head. (it gets your attention). My concern with those folks is that next time they have an event like where the two guys got killed by local Texas police, it will be swarming with local gun folks sitting in their cars waiting on something.

[dallaswareagle]

For the record, a .30-06 scares me as much or more than an AR-15.  A man ready to kill, with a plan, behind a scoped .30-06 is terrifying thought.  Asshole in a crowded room of people not willing to fight between mag changes is easy pickings, no doubt. But he could have did the same amount of killing with ANY firearm in those circumstances.

One person, trained and armed in that crowd could have prevented most/some of the killing.

[dallaswareagle]

I get the whole "Guns don't kill people..." argument.  Agree with it.  And I'll take my chances with our government not overthrowing the republic.  That ain't happening.  I may eventually move to a Caribbean island when idiot policies like Obama Care hit too hard or the guilt from my white privilege becomes too much for me to bear.  But there will never be a time when I'm taking my family and my guns and heading to the woods to avoid getting kilt by my own police or military.  Not gonna' waste one minute of time worrying or even thinking about it.

Been a while since I was in but I am pretty sure we don't go after low level targets. 

[Token]

It's nice living in a part of the country where concealed carry is not frowned upon. They tend to be responsible people. It's the open carry idiots that give gun owners a bad name. No reason a redneck needs to go into an eating establishment and place an Ak on the table fully loaded. It's purely a head issue they have. Concealed is safe and gets the job done.

All that dumbass is doing is giving a mental person who can't purchase that type of weapon the means to get his hands on one and kill a bunch of people. I'm willing to bet that less than 10% of open carry morons have any training on weapon retention.

Carry your weapon. Train with your weapon. But don't show the crazy gun wielding killer your weapon until you have to do it. He won't be expecting it, you have the upper hand. BUT BUT BUT, when you hear sirens you better have already handled business or be willing to throw your gun down and lay down. Because you don't want to be the guy holding the gun in a public place when 20 officers are responding to active shooter.  They aren't going to ask questions, they aren't going to be reasonable and you will likely be considered the threat.  So gun enthusiast be aware of that.

[dallaswareagle]

All that dumbass is doing is giving a mental person who can't purchase that type of weapon the means to get his hands on one and kill a bunch of people. I'm willing to bet that less than 10% of open carry morons have any training on weapon retention.

Carry your weapon. Train with your weapon. But don't show the crazy gun wielding killer your weapon until you have to do it. He won't be expecting it, you have the upper hand. BUT BUT BUT, when you hear sirens you better have already handled business or be willing to throw your gun down and lay down. Because you don't want to be the guy holding the gun in a public place when 20 officers are responding to active shooter.  They aren't going to ask questions, they aren't going to be reasonable and you will likely be considered the threat.  So gun enthusiast be aware of that.

If memory serves during training (MOUT) Military operations in urban terrain, that if we didn't drop our target within the first 10 to 15 seconds our likely hood of survival decreased greatly. So the moral of the story either hit your target or become one.   

[Saniflush]

All that dumbass is doing is giving a mental person who can't purchase that type of weapon the means to get his hands on one and kill a bunch of people. I'm willing to bet that less than 10% of open carry morons have any training on weapon retention.

Carry your weapon. Train with your weapon. But don't show the crazy gun wielding killer your weapon until you have to do it. He won't be expecting it, you have the upper hand. BUT BUT BUT, when you hear sirens you better have already handled business or be willing to throw your gun down and lay down. Because you don't want to be the guy holding the gun in a public place when 20 officers are responding to active shooter.  They aren't going to ask questions, they aren't going to be reasonable and you will likely be considered the threat.  So gun enthusiast be aware of that.

This.  I carry every day but only my boss and his boss know I do.  I don't want that one motherfucker knowing where it's coming from.

[GH2001]

This.  I carry every day but only my boss and his boss know I do.  I don't want that one motherfucker knowing where it's coming from.

So I guess I don't need to be a smart mouth around you next time we're drinking at x gate? Noted.

Srs though. The bammer cop is spot on with that response. In the end, a gun is a right. But it's still also a deadly weapon. Treat it as such and respect it.

[Snaggletiger]

For the record, a .30-06 scares me as much or more than an AR-15.  A man ready to kill, with a plan, behind a scoped .30-06 is terrifying thought.  Asshole in a crowded room of people not willing to fight between mag changes is easy pickings, no doubt. But he could have did the same amount of killing with ANY firearm in those circumstances.

In the end, I'll to defer to you on this but please to be explaining.  In particular, the "any firearm" statement.  Yes, it was obvious that no one in that club was prepared and/or willing to fight back. But they were trying to get the hell out of there.  Put yourself in the coward's (Shooters) shoes, with the stipulation of you knowing what you know given your training and experience.

Your plan is to go to this club, where several hundred people are. You want to take out as many as possible, as quickly as possible.  You know it will be utter chaos once you start shooting with people running for the exits.  What you have available is whatever weapons you can purchase at the local gun shop.  You can choose one firearm and enough ammo to reload as often as you can. 

I know you can see where I'm going with this but, what do you pick? 

[GH2001]

In the end, I'll to defer to you on this but please to be explaining.  In particular, the "any firearm" statement.  Yes, it was obvious that no one in that club was prepared and/or willing to fight back. But they were trying to get the hell out of there.  Put yourself in the coward's (Shooters) shoes, with the stipulation of you knowing what you know given your training and experience.

Your plan is to go to this club, where several hundred people are. You want to take out as many as possible, as quickly as possible.  You know it will be utter chaos once you start shooting with people running for the exits.  What you have available is whatever weapons you can purchase at the local gun shop.  You can choose one firearm and enough ammo to reload as often as you can. 

I know you can see where I'm going with this but, what do you pick?

And just to think that you could have easily been there on that night. Glad you picked another night to go.

[Snaggletiger]

And just to think that you could have easily been there on that night. Glad you picked another night to go.

I hated missing Latin Night but my tummy was upset.

[dallaswareagle]

In the end, I'll to defer to you on this but please to be explaining.  In particular, the "any firearm" statement.  Yes, it was obvious that no one in that club was prepared and/or willing to fight back. But they were trying to get the hell out of there.  Put yourself in the coward's (Shooters) shoes, with the stipulation of you knowing what you know given your training and experience.

Your plan is to go to this club, where several hundred people are. You want to take out as many as possible, as quickly as possible.  You know it will be utter chaos once you start shooting with people running for the exits.  What you have available is whatever weapons you can purchase at the local gun shop.  You can choose one firearm and enough ammo to reload as often as you can. 

I know you can see where I'm going with this but, what do you pick?

And the black choppers start circling. 

[Token]

And the black choppers start circling. 

Michael J Fox??  Because that's the only reason it would take that long reload an AR 15. It's literally less than 5 seconds to drop and reload.

[Pell City Tiger]

I see open carry people every time I walk into a store or restaurant around my town. Keep in mind, the assholes hell bent on robbery or committing other forms of mayhem are looking for soft targets to hit. That being said, I can see some benefit to open carry. It can provide a visual deterrent against some of these assholes. Walking in and seeing a few people with a peacemaker strapped to their side might make them think twice before hitting that location.

I can see both sides of the argument.