So, What Do You Think About Russia/Georgia?

[Snaggletiger]

I'm curious about how we react to this.  I know Bush has given them several ultimatums over the past few days to get out.  Sounds like a lot of rhetoric on Russia's part but apparently they aren't in a hurry to leave.

Is it our business?  Should we care?

Could we do anything about it anyway?  I'm assuming our military is stretched thin with the war in the Middle East.

And what does the rest of the world think about this, especially those countries where this is happening in their own back yard?

I'm just not knowlegeable enough about the effects of this conflict on the world if any, so I'm asking for input.  There's part of me that hears our government give ultimatums and I think, "STFU, we're not the world's fucking police."

Am I wrong?  Should we be concerned about this?

[wesfau2]

We should be concerned, but not because the fight is ours to take up.  We should be concerned because Putin is essentially showing the world that we're too thinly stretched to do more than shake our fists at him and insist that he listen to us.

[mglKSAU]

I like the malls in Atlanta.  Savannah is a pretty neat city.  Other than that, I'm not really sure what Georgia has to offer.  Russia has Vodka and some pretty hot ladies.  Putin can be embarrassing if it is in public, but in the privacy of one's home, quite relieving.  I think the main problem lies in the fact that the Iraq doesn't have any maps.  Wait...what?

[D-Day]

All I know is I couldn't be any more excited if it were Christmas morning and the GI Joe aircraft carrier was sitting next to the tree ready for me to open. To think that the Bear might be coming out of hibernation and the Cold War may pick up where it left off... I get goose bumps thinking about it. No more fucking insurgencies, no more fucking IEDs... we may have ourselves a real enemy again that wears a uniform and sports tanks and fighter planes and isn't afraid to duke it out face to face like men.

Mother Russia is BACK!!   

[Jumbo]

I think Uga would win by two touchdowns.

[AuburnChopper 3.0]

I say we just send Jumbo out there in a golf cart, give him about 6 beers and 200 yards to put a little ball in a hole....  After the first two hours, the Russians will just say "Fuck it", and leave....

    

[Tiger Six]

All I know is I couldn't be any more excited if it were Christmas morning and the GI Joe aircraft carrier was sitting next to the tree ready for me to open. To think that the Bear might be coming out of hibernation and the Cold War may pick up where it left off... I get goose bumps thinking about it. No more fucking insurgencies, no more fucking IEDs... we may have ourselves a real enemy again that wears a uniform and sports tanks and fighter planes and isn't afraid to duke it out face to face like men.

Mother Russia is BACK!!   

And all the piece of shit Reservists that whine and complain about their ten months tours get a dose of total mobilization! 

Wait...that's not a good thing for me, is it?

[GarMan]

I'm curious about how we react to this.  I know Bush has given them several ultimatums over the past few days to get out.  Sounds like a lot of rhetoric on Russia's part but apparently they aren't in a hurry to leave.

Is it our business?  Should we care?

Could we do anything about it anyway?  I'm assuming our military is stretched thin with the war in the Middle East.

And what does the rest of the world think about this, especially those countries where this is happening in their own back yard?

I'm just not knowlegeable enough about the effects of this conflict on the world if any, so I'm asking for input.  There's part of me that hears our government give ultimatums and I think, "STFU, we're not the world's fucking police."

Am I wrong?  Should we be concerned about this?

Bush has failed an ally.  It's that simple.  An ultimatum is worthless if you're unwilling to do anything about it.  We should already have troups there, and we should have already escorted the Russians out of that country... or killed them.  If this is what the rest of the world can expect from an alliance with the United States, what good is an alliance with the United States? 

Furthermore, you guys really need to stop watching DNC-TV.  Our military is not spread too thin.  About a year ago, I heard that less than half of our active duty military has spent any time in the Middle East. 

Finally, Russia is back, and they have money now.  If we don't squelch these incidents quickly, they're going to do this everywhere.  They've already been talking about Cuba again. 

[Snaggletiger]

Bush has failed an ally.  It's that simple.  An ultimatum is worthless if you're unwilling to do anything about it.  We should already have troups there, and we should have already escorted the Russians out of that country... or killed them.  If this is what the rest of the world can expect from an alliance with the United States, what good is an alliance with the United States? 

Furthermore, you guys really need to stop watching DNC-TV.  Our military is not spread too thin.  About a year ago, I heard that less than half of our active duty military has spent any time in the Middle East. 

Finally, Russia is back, and they have money now.  If we don't squelch these incidents quickly, they're going to do this everywhere.  They've already been talking about Cuba again. 

But why us?  I can see how Russian aggression could ultimately have an effect on us but this is happening in the back yard of dozens of countries...many of which are our allies.  Why aren't they pissed off and threatening military involvement?  When we invaded Iraq, there were a multitude of seemingly legitimate reasons for doing so, WMD's, terrorist training, human rights atrocities etc.  This was occurring half way around the world and it was the U.S. along with a handful of others who stepped up and committed to that undertaking.  I remember vividly, the massive riots and protests around the world about our impending invasion of Iraq.  I kept asking why the hell weren't these people concerned or willing to do something?  It's happening right at your freakin' borders. 

I would have no problem going in there and kicking Russia the hell out of Georgia if we were doing it as part of a greater, unified group of nations who were on the same page as we are.  It just seems like the U.S. is the only country to be willing to jump in the fray, most times in opposition to what their "Allies" think.

Disclaimer: The "We" refers to our government and our fighting men and women, like Randall, Adam, that Scotch drinking bastard and all the others who have served.  I don't pretend that I have sufficient sac to pick up a gun and march in to Iraq, Georgia or anywhere else.  My sac is small.  I salute your sacs.  Not in a gay way, though.

[Tarheel]

The Republic of Georgia is a political ally of the U. S. but nothing more than that (unfortunately for them). I think that their military alliance with us was one-sided in Afghanistan in that they were helping the NATO forces there.  We (as in the U S) failed Georgia long ago by not pressing hard to allow their entry into NATO which would have made them a military ally too. 

At this point I think that we'll do nothing beyond political posturing.  We probably could deploy significant numbers of our own armed forces there but we won't even though there's reason to do so beyond just defending Georgia and that, my friends, is that we may need to defend the Baku-Tbilisi-Ceyhan oil pipeline if the Russians try to interdict the oil flow as it flows directly into Turkey which IS a part of NATO.

The UN will do nothing (and can do nothing effective since Russia has veto power on the Security Council).  This is Prague Spring 1968 all over again and UN are just going to sit and watch (as will we).  The UN did nothing then and will do nothing now.
 
If we do want to up the ante so to speak what we (as in the US) should do bring Ukraine, Belarus, Moldova, and the Central Asian republics into the NATO family.  That would infuriate the Russians.  The Russian bear might still attack them but the NATO alliance would be compelled to respond in force.

At this point this incident is a political (and shameful) embarrassment specifically for President Bush (and the US by extension) that will never go away. 

And what's worse is that it sends the wrong message to China regarding their designs on Taiwan.  Will we defend Taiwan if China invades that island?  And, yes, what will do about Cuba?  Interesting questions to think about when you go to the polls this November.

[JohnDeere]

The Republic of Georgia is a political ally of the U. S. but nothing more than that (unfortunately for them). I think that their military alliance with us was one-sided in Afghanistan in that they were helping the NATO forces there.  We (as in the U S) failed Georgia long ago by not pressing hard to allow their entry into NATO which would have made them a military ally too. 

You are incorrect. There were 3,000 Georgian soldiers in Iraq prior to the invasion of their country. That was the third largest contingent of  Multi National Forces Iraq behind the UK.  What there effing mission in Iraq was or the combat effectiveness is irrelivant. Georgia stood with the U.S.. during OIF, with the hope of becoming allied with other "free democracies" such as the U.S., U.K., and the rest of NATO.
The former U.S.S.R basically called Georgia out for their "ties" with the U.S. and on their ambitions of joing NATO. Georgia basically got the "blue falcon" from the U.S. and NATO.  I don't consider Sen. Durbin arriving to save the day on C-5 full of MRE's much help with two Russian Armor Divisions in the fight.


 

[Tarheel]

You are incorrect. There were 3,000 Georgian soldiers in Iraq prior to the invasion of their country. That was the third largest contingent of  Multi National Forces Iraq behind the UK.  What there effing mission in Iraq was or the combat effectiveness is irrelivant. Georgia stood with the U.S.. during OIF, with the hope of becoming allied with other "free democracies" such as the U.S., U.K., and the rest of NATO.
The former U.S.S.R basically called Georgia out for their "ties" with the U.S. and on their ambitions of joing NATO. Georgia basically got the "blue falcon" from the U.S. and NATO.  I don't consider Sen. Durbin arriving to save the day on C-5 full of MRE's much help with two Russian Armor Divisions in the fight.

I'm not afraid to admit when I'm wrong.  I did not know that Georgian forces were in Iraq as well as Afghanistan.  I'd heard that they were pulling out of Afghanistan but had not heard about Iraq.

Other than that I stand by my analysis because they stood with us and NATO in both Iraq and Afghanistan respectively that makes our doing nothing to help them all the more shameful despite "Turban" Durbin's mission (which I had not heard about either).

PS:

The Republic of Georgia is a political ally of the U. S. but nothing more than that (unfortunately for them).
...

What I should have written was that we are a political ally to Georgia for our own ends; obviously we're not helping them defend their country with our military but they were perfectly willing to use their military to help us (and NATO).

[Snaggletiger]

Now THIS is what I was looking for.  I didn't know any of this shit.  Appreciate the analysis.

[GarMan]

Call it whatever, we are still failing an ally.  It disgusts me.  By the way, the Russians just took possession of American Humvees when they took the port earlier this week.  Yes, Georgia was with us in both conflicts.  They may have not been part of the initial waves, but they were there to support us. 

[Tarheel]

Now THIS is what I was looking for.  I didn't know any of this shit.  Appreciate the analysis.

It looks like we've upped the ante by signing a missile defense shield agreement with Poland as of today.  Russia has responded today by saying that their response "will go beyond diplomacy".

Here's some excerpts from the article:

Russia warns of response to US missile shield 
 
Aug 20 01:42 PM US/Eastern
 
MOSCOW (AP) - Russia says its response to the further development of a U.S. missile shield in Poland will go beyond diplomacy.  Russia's Foreign Ministry issued a statement saying the U.S. missile shield plans are clearly aimed at weakening Russia.

The U.S. says the missile defense system is aimed at protecting the U.S. and Europe from future attacks from states like Iran.

The United States and Poland signed a deal Wednesday to place a U.S. missile defense base just 115 miles from Russia's westernmost fringe.
...

The link:

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D92M5GM81&show_article=1

[mglKSAU]

This seems like the type of situation that could get waaaayy out of hand really easily.  Not that it hasn't already.  I'm not sure what the right solution is, but I know that whatever is done needs to be done with the utmost care.