Holy crap...

AUChizad · « **Reply #20 on:** March 21, 2012, 02:41:17 PM »

And another thing.

Is Goodell going to come down even harder on Washington where it was determined that Gregg Williams ran this exact same fucking thing for four years?

Snaggletiger · « **Reply #21 on:** March 21, 2012, 02:57:42 PM »

Quote from: AUJarhead on March 21, 2012, 02:29:14 PM

And the NFL is also saying this happened last season, and Cam Newton was a specific target.

Teams have been trying that for years. You don't tug on Superman's cape.

Aside from the Saint hate, this really is BS. #1 the penalties are way over the top and B. yes it does go on all over the league. A couple of weeks ago, a former Bills safety admitted they had bounties for injuring players. Numerous other players around the league have admitted to a bounty system with most saying it was just for great hits/plays. But, with all the talk, I'd hate to see one team hammered and made an example of when it's common knowledge this stuff happens all over.

JR4AU · « **Reply #22 on:** March 21, 2012, 03:09:58 PM »

Quote from: AUChizad on March 21, 2012, 02:17:46 PM

Seriously, this is some fucking bullshit.

All over something that I'm 100% certain goes on in every fucking locker room in the NFL. Everyone involved has said it was a bounty for "big hits", not to intentionally hurt people, and I can't see any way the NFL can empirically prove otherwise. I hope they sue for arbitrary and capricious penalty and irreparable harm.

What did Buddy Ryan get punished for his Bounty Bowls? He fucking didn't. Also, I want a full investigation of the 49'ers playoff knockout of Pierre Thomas if these are the rules we're playing by. Belichick was actually fucking cheating, and what'd he get? A couple bucks fine? Zero games suspended?

This is complete and utter garbage.

While what you say about it going on everywhere is true, not everybody got caught and ratted out. Goodell definitely made a statement. I wondered which way he'd go. He aint fucking playing.

AWK · « **Reply #23 on:** March 21, 2012, 03:15:42 PM »

Quote from: AUChizad on March 21, 2012, 02:17:46 PM

Seriously, this is some fucking bullshit.

All over something that I'm 100% certain goes on in every fucking locker room in the NFL. Everyone involved has said it was a bounty for "big hits", not to intentionally hurt people, and I can't see any way the NFL can empirically prove otherwise. I hope they sue for arbitrary and capricious penalty and irreparable harm.

What did Buddy Ryan get punished for his Bounty Bowls? He fucking didn't. Also, I want a full investigation of the 49'ers playoff knockout of Pierre Thomas if these are the rules we're playing by. Belichick was actually fucking cheating, and what'd he get? A couple bucks fine? Zero games suspended?

This is complete and utter garbage.

I'm not saying the crime = punishment, but if you read some of what happened Payton lied to Goodell after this was brought up. They even had emails from the beginning of the 2011 season where some of Payton's friends, non-football related, were emailing him wagers/bounties on players...and he admitted to it. That's not good.

www.profootballtalk.com

War Eagle!!! · « **Reply #24 on:** March 21, 2012, 04:15:35 PM »

Quote from: AWK on March 21, 2012, 03:15:42 PM

I'm not saying the crime = punishment, but if you read some of what happened Payton lied to Goodell after this was brought up. They even had emails from the beginning of the 2011 season where some of Payton's friends, non-football related, were emailing him wagers/bounties on players...and he admitted to it. That's not good.

www.profootballtalk.com

Silly facts...

Saniflush · « **Reply #25 on:** March 21, 2012, 04:26:01 PM »

Those penalties sound gooder.

Tiger Wench · « **Reply #26 on:** March 21, 2012, 04:52:06 PM »

Aaron Rogers, Brett Favre and Kurt Warner (because Saints fans HATE Kurt Whiner and his former team teh Rams) - those all make sense. These guys can get in the way of the playoffs.

But CAM? Why him? Here's a thought - bet that fucker Ingram was behind that. Who else in the Saints locker room would have it out for Cam? How bout suspending HIS sorry ass?

The Prowler · « **Reply #27 on:** March 21, 2012, 05:11:12 PM »

Quote from: Tiger Wench on March 21, 2012, 04:52:06 PM

Aaron Rogers, Brett Favre and Kurt Warner (because Saints fans HATE Kurt Whiner and his former team teh Rams) - those all make sense. These guys can get in the way of the playoffs.

But CAM? Why him? Here's a thought - bet that fucker Ingram was behind that. Who else in the Saints locker room would have it out for Cam? How bout suspending HIS sorry ass?

I concur.

AWK · « **Reply #28 on:** March 21, 2012, 05:12:50 PM »

Quote from: Tiger Wench on March 21, 2012, 04:52:06 PM

Aaron Rogers, Brett Favre and Kurt Warner (because Saints fans HATE Kurt Whiner and his former team teh Rams) - those all make sense. These guys can get in the way of the playoffs.

But CAM? Why him? Here's a thought - bet that fucker Ingram was behind that. Who else in the Saints locker room would have it out for Cam? How bout suspending HIS sorry ass?

Pissed me off as well regarding Cam.

Vandy Vol · « **Reply #29 on:** March 21, 2012, 05:16:45 PM »

Quote from: Tiger Wench on March 21, 2012, 04:52:06 PM

Aaron Rogers, Brett Favre and Kurt Warner (because Saints fans HATE Kurt Whiner and his former team teh Rams) - those all make sense. These guys can get in the way of the playoffs.

But CAM? Why him? Here's a thought - bet that fucker Ingram was behind that. Who else in the Saints locker room would have it out for Cam? How bout suspending HIS sorry ass?

You're assuming that their bounties only apply to teams that can get in the way of the playoffs.

What if they're just doing it for shits and giggles? To see who can "one up" the other? I mean, if they were sitting down and plotting which players to injure for strategic purposes only, why would they attach monetary rewards and bragging rights?

My guess is that these bounties were weekly "goals" to injure/place big hits on playmakers, regardless of whether those teams and their playmakers had any serious chances at being in the playoffs.

AUChizad · « **Reply #30 on:** March 21, 2012, 05:23:56 PM »

No one knows media bullshit better.

http://blogs.charlotte.com/panthers/2012/03/cam-newton-surprised-he-was-saints-target.html

Quote

"It caught me by surprise. But with me knowing some of the guys on the Saints, I know they are good guys," Newton said on the Times' video. "So you can't really believe all what the media makes of it. But it's still, golly, why is this being mentioned? Like they say, where there's smoke there's fire. But I just can't understand it."

Saniflush · « **Reply #31 on:** March 21, 2012, 05:30:48 PM »

Sounds fake. I bet he was smiling when he said it.

AUChizad · « **Reply #32 on:** March 21, 2012, 05:35:18 PM »

Quote from: Saniflush on March 21, 2012, 05:30:48 PM

Sounds fake. I bet he was smiling when he said it.

That goddamn thug used "golly" as an ejaculate.

War Eagle!!! · « **Reply #33 on:** March 21, 2012, 05:39:14 PM »

Quote from: AUChizad on March 21, 2012, 05:23:56 PM

No one knows media bullshit better.

http://blogs.charlotte.com/panthers/2012/03/cam-newton-surprised-he-was-saints-target.html

Not media. This is what the league determined as fact during their investigation:

Quote

The findings in the league’s investigation, corroborated by multiple independent sources, conclusively established the following:

1. The Saints defensive team operated a pay-for-performance/bounty program, primarily funded by players, during the 2009, 2010, and 2011 seasons. Under that program, players regularly made cash “donations” to a pool, and were “fined” for mental errors, loafing, penalties, and the like. At least one assistant coach (defensive coordinator Gregg Williams) also occasionally contributed to the pool. There is no evidence that any club money was contributed to the program.

2. Payments were made for plays such as interceptions or fumble recoveries. All such payments are against league rules. Payments also were made for plays on which opposing players were injured. In addition, specific players were sometimes targeted. The investigation showed bounties being placed on four quarterbacks of opposing teams – Brett Favre, Cam Newton, Aaron Rodgers, and Kurt Warner. Multiple sources have confirmed that several players pledged funds toward bounties on specific opposing players, with defensive captain Jonathan Vilma offering $10,000 to any player who knocked Brett Favre out of the NFC Championship Game in 2010.

3. Coach Williams acknowledged that he designed and implemented the program with the assistance of certain defensive players. He said that he did so after being told by Saints Head Coach Sean Payton that his assignment was to make the defense “nasty.” Coach Williams described his role as overseeing record keeping, defining payout amounts, deciding on who received payouts, and distributing envelopes with cash to players who “earned” rewards.

4. In each of the 2009-2011 seasons, the Saints were one of the top five teams in the league in roughing the passer penalties. In 2009 and 2011, the Saints were also in the top five teams in unnecessary roughness penalties; in 2010, the Saints ranked sixth in the category. In the January 16, 2010 divisional playoff game against the Arizona Cardinals, Saints defensive players were assessed $15,000 in fines for fouls committed against opposing players. The following week, in the NFC Championship Game against the Minnesota Vikings, Saints defensive players were assessed $30,000 in fines for four separate illegal hits, several of which were directed against quarterback Brett Favre.

5. Coach Williams now acknowledges that when he was first questioned about this matter in early 2010 he intentionally misled NFL investigators and made no effort to stop the program after he became aware of the league’s investigation.

6. Coach Williams further confirmed that the program continued during the 2010 and 2011 seasons, and that he occasionally contributed funds to the pool in each of those seasons.

7. Assistant Head Coach/Defense Joe Vitt acknowledged that he was aware of the program in 2009-2011. He admitted that, when interviewed in 2010, he “fabricated the truth” to NFL investigators and denied that any pay-for-performance or bounty program existed at the Saints.

8. Coach Vitt said one of his primary roles was to monitor the activity of Coach Williams. This was based on the direction of Coach Payton, who apparently had less than full confidence in Coach Williams. Despite Coach Vitt’s knowledge of the bounty program, his understanding of the terms “knock-out” and “cart-off,” his witnessing Coach Williams handing out envelopes that he believed to contain cash, and his acknowledgement that the defensive meeting preceding the 2010 NFC Championship Game may have “got out of hand” with respect to Brett Favre, Coach Vitt claimed he never advised either Coach Payton or General Manager Mickey Loomis of the “pay-for-performance/bounty” program.

9. A summary prepared following a Saints preseason game included the statement, “1 Cart-off – Crank up the John Deer (sic) Tractor” in reference to a hit on an opposing player. Similar statements are reflected in prepared documents or slides in connection with other games in multiple seasons. A review of the game films confirms that opposing players were injured on the plays identified in the documents.

10. When interviewed in 2012, Sean Payton claimed to be entirely unaware of the program, a claim contradicted by others. Further, prior to the Saints’ opening game in 2011, Coach Payton received an email from a close associate that stated in part, “PS Greg Williams put me down for $5000 on Rogers (sic).” When shown the email during the course of the investigation, Coach Payton stated that it referred to a “bounty” on Green Bay quarterback Aaron Rodgers.

11. In early 2010, Mr. Loomis advised Coach Payton that the league office was investigating allegations concerning a bounty program. Coach Payton said that he met with his top two defensive assistants, Coach Williams and Coach Vitt, in advance of the interview with league investigators and told them, “Let’s make sure our ducks are in a row.” Remarkably, Coach Payton claimed that he never inquired of Coach Williams and Coach Vitt as to what happened in the interviews, never asked them if a “pay-for-performance” or bounty program was in fact in place, and never gave any instructions to discontinue such a program.

12. In January 2012, prior to the Saints’ first playoff game of the 2011 season, Coach Payton was advised by Mr. Loomis that the league office had reopened the investigation. Coach Payton made a cursory inquiry but took no action to ensure that any bounty program was discontinued.

13. General Manager Mickey Loomis was not present at meetings of the Saints defense at which bounties were discussed and was not aware of bounties being placed on specific players. Mr. Loomis became aware of the allegations regarding a bounty program no later than February 2010 when he was notified of the investigation into the allegations during a meeting with NFL Executive Vice President-Football Operations Ray Anderson. He was directed to ensure that any such program ceased immediately. By his own admission, Mr. Loomis did not do enough to determine if a pay-for-performance/bounty program existed or to end any such program that did exist.

14. Saints owner Tom Benson notified Mr. Loomis in January 2012 prior to the team’s participation in the playoffs that the league’s investigation had been reopened. Mr. Benson reiterated his position that a bounty program was unacceptable and instructed Mr. Loomis to ensure that if a bounty program existed at the Saints it would stop immediately. By his own admission, Mr. Loomis responded to this direction by making only cursory inquiries of Coaches Payton and Williams. He never issued instructions to end the bounty program to either the coaching staff or the players.

15. There is no evidence that Saints ownership had any knowledge of the pay-for-performance or bounty program. There is no evidence that any club funds were used for the program. Ownership made clear that it disapproved of the program, gave prompt and clear direction that it stop, and gave full and immediate cooperation to league investigators.

AUChizad · « **Reply #34 on:** March 21, 2012, 05:53:22 PM »

Quote from: War Eagle!!! on March 21, 2012, 05:39:14 PM

Not media. This is what the league determined as fact during their investigation:

Boo fuckin' hoo.

Get ready for two hand touch in the No Fun League in the near future.

Of those 15 points, the only thing I'll give you as problematic whatsoever is 8/9. Call me naive, but I believe the "cart-off" and "knock-out" shit is analogous to "The money was too much". Yes, there was probably more of a payout for huge hits than small tackles. The "cart-off" and "knock-out" shit, until I see the full context, seems to me to be rhetoric. If they said "rip his head off" would they be charged for attempted murder?

As for the rest of that, it has been said time and time again by at least a handful in every fucking organization in the NFL that that goes on at every single program.

I can tell you for a fact that years before this bountygate shit ever came to light, I was told about this same type of system (where players are made to pay into a pot for mistakes, and gets paid out for positive things) happens in minor league baseball locker rooms for Christ's sake. Not necessarily all on-the-field stuff, but a guy gets fined for stinking up the bathroom, and gets paid out for luring the big-tittied chick to the dugout asking for an autograph. And coaches were involved.

chinook · « **Reply #35 on:** March 21, 2012, 06:10:15 PM »

for those of you who turned this thread from the almighty to discussing that fake smiling thug will all burn in hell. may tebow cast you to hell with him.

JR4AU · « **Reply #36 on:** March 21, 2012, 06:36:15 PM »

Don't think this didn't have a shitload to do with it do you?

Quote

10. When interviewed in 2012, Sean Payton claimed to be entirely unaware of the program, a claim contradicted by others. Further, prior to the Saints’ opening game in 2011, Coach Payton received an email from a close associate that stated in part, “PS Greg Williams put me down for $5000 on Rogers (sic).” When shown the email during the course of the investigation, Coach Payton stated that it referred to a “bounty” on Green Bay quarterback Aaron Rodgers.

Townhallsavoy · « **Reply #37 on:** March 21, 2012, 06:55:07 PM »

Can't post much. On phone. After reading about what the saints did I can say as a saints fan that we deserved worse.

War Eagle!!! · « **Reply #38 on:** March 21, 2012, 07:11:41 PM »

Gregg Williams statement:

Quote

"I'd like to again apologize wholeheartedly to the NFL, Coach Fisher, the entire Rams organization and all football fans for my actions. Furthermore, I apologize to the players of the NFL for my involvement as it is not a true reflection of my values as a father or coach, nor is it reflective of the great respect I have for this game and its core principle of sportsmanship. I accept full responsibility for my actions. I highly value the 23 years that I've spent in the NFL. I will continue to cooperate fully with the league and its investigation and I will focus my energies on serving as an advocate for both player safety and sportsmanship. I will do everything possible to re-earn the respect of my colleagues, the NFL and its players in hopes of returning to coaching in the future."

New Orleans Saint's statement:

Quote

Today, Commissioner Goodell apprised us of the severe penalties facing our club, as proposed by the NFL.

We recognize our fans' concerns and we regret the uncertainty this episode has created for them. We are humbled by the support our organization has received from our fans today in the wake of this announcement, and we ask them to continue to stand with us, as they have done in the past, when both our team and our city have overcome greater adversities.

To our fans, the NFL and the rest of our league, we offer our sincere apology and take full responsibility for these serious violations.

It has always been the goal of the New Orleans Saints to create a model franchise and to impact our league in a positive manner.

There is no place for bounties in our league and we reiterate our pledge that this will never happen again.

Chizad's statement:

Quote from: AUChizad on March 21, 2012, 05:53:22 PM

Boo fuckin' hoo.

Get ready for two hand touch in the No Fun League in the near future.

Of those 15 points, the only thing I'll give you as problematic whatsoever is 8/9. Call me naive, but I believe the "cart-off" and "knock-out" shit is analogous to "The money was too much". Yes, there was probably more of a payout for huge hits than small tackles. The "cart-off" and "knock-out" shit, until I see the full context, seems to me to be rhetoric. If they said "rip his head off" would they be charged for attempted murder?

As for the rest of that, it has been said time and time again by at least a handful in every fucking organization in the NFL that that goes on at every single program.

Kaos · « **Reply #39 on:** March 21, 2012, 09:45:56 PM »

Quote from: AUChizad on March 21, 2012, 05:53:22 PM

Boo fuckin' hoo.

Get ready for two hand touch in the No Fun League in the near future.

Of those 15 points, the only thing I'll give you as problematic whatsoever is 8/9. Call me naive, but I believe the "cart-off" and "knock-out" shit is analogous to "The money was too much". Yes, there was probably more of a payout for huge hits than small tackles. The "cart-off" and "knock-out" shit, until I see the full context, seems to me to be rhetoric. If they said "rip his head off" would they be charged for attempted murder?

As for the rest of that, it has been said time and time again by at least a handful in every fucking organization in the NFL that that goes on at every single program.

I can tell you for a fact that years before this bountygate shit ever came to light, I was told about this same type of system (where players are made to pay into a pot for mistakes, and gets paid out for positive things) happens in minor league baseball locker rooms for Christ's sake. Not necessarily all on-the-field stuff, but a guy gets fined for stinking up the bathroom, and gets paid out for luring the big-tittied chick to the dugout asking for an autograph. And coaches were involved.

I know this will be lost on you, but every single post of yours in this thread sounds exactly like the Finebaum Show, circa February 1, 2002. Exactly.

"They hammerin' us for somethin' that goes on at EVER school, Pawwwl. This some damn BS. They pickin' on us Pawwwwl, 'cause we so damn good."