Alabama Is One of the Worst States for Education...Can't Imagine Why

[Townhallsavoy]

State Sen. Shadrack McGill defended a pay raise his predecessors in the Legislature passed, but said doubling teacher pay could lead to less-qualified educators.

At a prayer breakfast in Fort Payne this week, McGill was asked about the death of a defendant in the public corruption trial that was scheduled to begin Monday. Ray Crosby, a former legislative employee, was facing one count of bribery in federal court.

Also on trial are one current and two former state senators, a lobbyist and consultant for gambling and a casino owner.
McGill, R-Woodville, said a 62 percent pay raise in 2007 - passed first by a controversial voice vote and later in an override of a veto by then-Gov. Bob Riley - better rewards lawmakers and makes them less susceptible to being swayed by lobbyists.

Lawmakers entered the 2007 legislative session making $30,710 a year, a rate that had not been changed in 16 years. The raise increased it to $49,500 annually.

"That played into the corruption, guys, big time," he said. "You had your higher-ranking legislators that were connected with the lobbyists making up in the millions of dollars. They weren't worried about that $30,000 paid salary they were getting," McGill said, adding that lawmakers have to pay for their expenses out of pocket.

McGill said that by paying legislators more, they're less susceptible to taking bribes. 

"He needs to make enough that he can say no, in regards to temptation. ... Teachers need to make the money that they need to make. There needs to be a balance there. If you double what you're paying education, you know what's going to happen? I've heard the comment many times, ‘Well, the quality of education's going to go up.' That's never proven to happen, guys.

"It's a Biblical principle. If you double a teacher's pay scale, you'll attract people who aren't called to teach.

"To go in and raise someone's child for eight hours a day, or many people's children for eight hours a day, requires a calling. It better be a calling in your life. I know I wouldn't want to do it, OK?

"And these teachers that are called to teach, regardless of the pay scale, they would teach. It's just in them to do. It's the ability that God give 'em. And there are also some teachers, it wouldn't matter how much you would pay them, they would still perform to the same capacity. The capacity is obviously not good enough, fuckstick. Many good teachers leave the profession because of the pay.  Many bad teachers stay in the profession because of tenure.

"If you don't keep that in balance, you're going to attract people who are not called, who don't need to be teaching our children. So, everything has a balance."

Last year, McGill introduced a bill that would tie legislators' pay to the average teacher's pay, including benefits. He later claimed teachers in Alabama rank fourth in the nation in average pay and benefits of about $65,000.

"The AEA [Alabama Education Association] would have a tough time with that because they don't want people knowing that information," McGill told an audience in Fort Payne in November.

Sen. Phil Williams, R-Rainbow City, said last week he would introduce a bill to raise the pay of teachers on the job for fewer than nine years by 2½ percent. Williams said the state can't afford to give a raise to all teachers.

Rep. Craig Ford, D-Gadsden, told the Times-Journal on Friday that such a raise wouldn't be fair to longer-serving teachers.

"They're the ones that are having the hardest time paying their bills," said Ford, the House minority leader.
In a statement later in the day, Ford said, "This proposal may be one of the most absurd things Phil Williams and the Republican supermajority have ever tried to pull."

The new executive secretary of the Alabama Education Association, James Mabry, will be in Fort Payne on Wednesday to speak with AEA members about the upcoming legislative session.

The meeting will begin at 5 p.m. at the Fort Payne City Hall auditorium. The legislative session will begin Tuesday in Montgomery.

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http://times-journal.com/news/article_16355b2a-4c64-11e1-a0b1-001871e3ce6c.html

*I don't think teachers need more money.  I do think we're paid enough for how many days a year that we work especially if you have a master's degree.  But this guy is a moron.

[AUTiger1]

Stopped reading here.

State Sen. Shadrack McGill defended a pay raise his predecessors in the Legislature passed

Seriously, that makes absolutely no sense.

[GarMan]

Stopped reading here.

Seriously, that makes absolutely no sense.

Trusting in the government to educate our children was the first mistake.  Continuing to do so (throwing more money at it, NCLB, etc., etc.)...  Well, that's just plain stupid. 

[JR4AU]

Except in a few select public schools, the people are getting completely ripped off in regards to their tax dollars vs the education their kids get.  Sadly though, one of the main reasons is the parents are A: Stupid B: Uneducated themselves C: Don't value education in the least.  I once worked with a guy that beamed with pride when he'd tell you he wasn't paying for his son to get no college education because he'd done just fine without one.  He even said he'd encouraged his son NOT to waste his own money getting a college education.  More of the world is like this than most of you know if you're not forced to rub elbows with the great unwashed masses.

[Token]

Once upon a time, a man could make a good living off the sweat of his brow.  Not anymore.  The baby boomers destroyed the "union" factory jobs, and what little bit of "labor" work is left is being occupied by cheaper Hispanic with a stronger work ethic. 

Education is the way of the world.

[Townhallsavoy]

Except in a few select public schools, the people are getting completely ripped off in regards to their tax dollars vs the education their kids get.  Sadly though, one of the main reasons is the parents are A: Stupid B: Uneducated themselves C: Don't value education in the least.  I once worked with a guy that beamed with pride when he'd tell you he wasn't paying for his son to get no college education because he'd done just fine without one.  He even said he'd encouraged his son NOT to waste his own money getting a college education.  More of the world is like this than most of you know if you're not forced to rub elbows with the great unwashed masses.

I'm honestly okay with that thought as long as it's followed with "I done just fine without one because I work with my hands and got me a mechanic job" or "I done just fine without one because I work that factory line producin' goods for the world to use." 

Some people aren't meant to go to college.  It's why No Child Left Behind is a true crock of shit. 

But in reality, most people don't understand that without a college education (or least some kind of education) they have to work blue collar jobs if they want to make an honest living.  Nowadays, they just want stuff to be given to them. 

[JR4AU]

I'm honestly okay with that thought as long as it's followed with "I done just fine without one because I work with my hands and got me a mechanic job" or "I done just fine without one because I work that factory line producin' goods for the world to use." 

Some people aren't meant to go to college.  It's why No Child Left Behind is a true crock of shit. 

But in reality, most people don't understand that without a college education (or least some kind of education) they have to work blue collar jobs if they want to make an honest living.  Nowadays, they just want stuff to be given to them.

The guy that was the Vice Principal when I was in HS used to say "School ain't for everybody!"  That's actually true.  The guy I mentioned was a cop I worked with, and yeah, good job, decent pay, decent benefits.   The thing is there are far more people that are, or could be cut out for college, if they were encouraged early, and education made a priority.   

And no, there's nothing wrong with being a blue collar guy, and earning a living.  Even in those cases, to really make a decent living, you have to have some sort of "schooling" to make the most, and go as far as you can in the blue collar world. 

What pisses me off is seeing folks that have a HS diploma, and can't write a proper sentence.  My secretary routinely "red pens" letters we receive from other lawyer's offices.   Incredible the lack of ability some people have with the English language.  And I'm not talking mere grammatical or common punctuation errors.   Hell, my office got this memo from the main office recently.  It came from our office manager.  It was regarding taking time off and leave slips.  One sentence read: "When an employee takes off a day without prior notice, they should call the me at the main office, and notify their perspective office by phone."  Now when I call in to let my secretary know, she sees my number on caller ID and answers "perspective office".   Routinely see police reports, witness and defendant's statements where "want"  is used in place of "won't", "setting" in place of "sitting" among other misuses.  "I had went..." is very commonly used too.  All that is because they were allowed to get by with it in school.  Hell I've heard teachers say things like "I had went".       

[RWS]

What pisses me off is seeing folks that have a HS diploma, and can't write a proper sentence.  My secretary routinely "red pens" letters we receive from other lawyer's offices.   Incredible the lack of ability some people have with the English language.  And I'm not talking mere grammatical or common punctuation errors.   Hell, my office got this memo from the main office recently.  It came from our office manager.  It was regarding taking time off and leave slips.  One sentence read: "When an employee takes off a day without prior notice, they should call the me at the main office, and notify their perspective office by phone."  Now when I call in to let my secretary know, she sees my number on caller ID and answers "perspective office".   Routinely see police reports, witness and defendant's statements where "want"  is used in place of "won't", "setting" in place of "sitting" among other misuses.  "I had went..." is very commonly used too.  All that is because they were allowed to get by with it in school.  Hell I've heard teachers say things like "I had went".     

At our department, if you don't spell words correctly or if you use improper grammar in your narrative, your shit gets sent back to you in the workflow. There is even a standard format that the narrative must be written in. Like you said, it makes you look like a dumbass when an attorney reads over a narrative that appears to be written by a 5th grader. 

[GarMan]

I'm honestly okay with that thought as long as it's followed with "I done just fine without one because I work with my hands and got me a mechanic job" or "I done just fine without one because I work that factory line producin' goods for the world to use." 

Some people aren't meant to go to college.  It's why...

The guy that was the Vice Principal when I was in HS used to say "School ain't for everybody!"  That's actually true.   

I can't subscribe to this at all.  Parents and public schools have created this situation.  Everyone could be capable of attaining higher education if they were only taught to do so, or better yet, if they learned how to accomplish it.  Granted, we could argue that everyone doesn't have the capacity to become Einsteins, but with the appropriate level of encouragement by parents and teachers along with the necessary lessons to achieve those goals, anyone can do it.  Unfortunately, too many have accepted varying degrees of mediocrity in virtually every aspect of their lives.  Far too many people have become accustomed to doing the bare minimum or just enough to get by...   

[AWK]

I'm glad I made it out alive...barely.

[Snaggletiger]

Education is not for everybody.  Someone has to manicure my lawn and clean the pool. And who's going to keep my wife happy during the day while I'm golfing?

[JR4AU]

I can't subscribe to this at all.  Parents and public schools have created this situation.  Everyone could be capable of attaining higher education if they were only taught to do so, or better yet, if they learned how to accomplish it.  Granted, we could argue that everyone doesn't have the capacity to become Einsteins, but with the appropriate level of encouragement by parents and teachers along with the necessary lessons to achieve those goals, anyone can do it.  Unfortunately, too many have accepted varying degrees of mediocrity in virtually every aspect of their lives.  Far too many people have become accustomed to doing the bare minimum or just enough to get by...

I think most are born with said capacity, but growing up in a home where the parents never stimulate a child's mind, and where they have no education themselves...the brain is like any muscle, if you don't work it, you lose the use of it over time.  Parents have the child to themselves for the most part for the first 4-5 years.  That's a hell of an amount of time.  Many are dropped off at school,  having already been environmentally stunted, and still get no support at home in academic pursuits while in school.  The schools can't do it alone. 

[wreckingball]

Did anyone see how Meshach and Abednego felt about this?

[Townhallsavoy]

I can't subscribe to this at all.  Parents and public schools have created this situation.  Everyone could be capable of attaining higher education if they were only taught to do so, or better yet, if they learned how to accomplish it.  Granted, we could argue that everyone doesn't have the capacity to become Einsteins, but with the appropriate level of encouragement by parents and teachers along with the necessary lessons to achieve those goals, anyone can do it.  Unfortunately, too many have accepted varying degrees of mediocrity in virtually every aspect of their lives.  Far too many people have become accustomed to doing the bare minimum or just enough to get by...

Higher education  isn't supposed to be another level of school.  It's competitive.  Only the best should be moving on to the jobs that foster academic competition. 

Like law school.  It isn't just, "Do you know your books of law very well?"  It's more like, "Are you a better performer than the student sitting next to you?"

[GarMan]

I think most are born with said capacity, but growing up in a home where the parents never stimulate a child's mind, and where they have no education themselves...the brain is like any muscle, if you don't work it, you lose the use of it over time.  Parents have the child to themselves for the most part for the first 4-5 years.  That's a hell of an amount of time.  Many are dropped off at school,  having already been environmentally stunted, and still get no support at home in academic pursuits while in school.  The schools can't do it alone.

I'm in complete agreement with that... 

Higher education  isn't supposed to be another level of school.  It's competitive.  Only the best should be moving on to the jobs that foster academic competition. 

Like law school.  It isn't just, "Do you know your books of law very well?"  It's more like, "Are you a better performer than the student sitting next to you?"

Well, a high school diploma isn't even going to get you very many blue collar jobs anymore.  I'm not suggesting that higher education needs to be Harvard across the board.  There are top tier universities, state and private universities, state and private colleges, community colleges and various trade schools.  When there aren't enough competitive openings at one level, you usually take the next best level until that desired position opens up for you.  There are an awful lot of openings at the lower tiers that never get filled for the reasons discussed.