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2012 Projected starting lineup

GH2001

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Re: 2012 Projected starting lineup
« Reply #20 on: November 28, 2011, 12:27:28 PM »
No, no, no, it's about schemes, and Auburn's Offense and Defense are patently flawed.

Its the total package. Ive never said it was a "100% scheme" problem. There is a putting the players in the right place problem. There is a playing to the player's strength problem. There has been SOME playcalling problems. There have been some coaching the players up problems. The last one is obvious on the OL and at the QB position. Its a lot of everything. I do know that Roof needs to go. I will not say the same about Gus but he needs to unfuck this shit I saw Saturday. Total bull hockey.Whether its coaching, prep, playcalling, putting better players in the right places......something. Any fucking thing.


The offensive production in those blowout losses is totally unacceptable. We have a roster littered with great talent. Gus gets a ton of money to produce results. He has not this year. Chris Todd was not leaps and bounds better out of HS than Trotter or Moseley. Maybe slightly better at most. Are you telling me that Moseley, Trotter and Frazier all have the same affliction?? All at the same time? They just forgot how to play QB this season, all of them? Frazier was a blue chip recruit, Moseley doesnt have a ton of stars by his name but the guy was Mr. Football his Sr year. He did something right at some point.


I really just dont think Gus has adjusted well to Cam being gone. He needs to go back to the drawing board. This is his job, to figure this shit out. Summed up, we have 2 avg, mediocre QBs on the roster but that is no reason to get our shit pushed in as bad as we have. We should be losing games with those 2 at QB, not getting ass raped. There is a disconnect on multiple levels.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2011, 12:29:56 PM by GH2001 »
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CCTAU

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Re: 2012 Projected starting lineup
« Reply #21 on: November 28, 2011, 12:32:15 PM »
If we do not go the Juco route at QB, I would not be surprised to see Trotter or Mosely back starting again next year. KF just did not seem to have that extra ummph to put him ahead of either of those guys. His running is not prolific, no explosiveness or elusiveness. And he cannot throw the ball. Unless he gets a lot quicker and learns to throw instead of float, he will not be the guy.
This being said, we have had years in the past where one of the starters from the previous season had a light come on and stepped up to the challenge. Will it happen again? Who knows.

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JR4AU

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Re: 2012 Projected starting lineup
« Reply #22 on: November 28, 2011, 12:50:01 PM »
Its the total package. Ive never said it was a "100% scheme" problem. There is a putting the players in the right place problem. There is a playing to the player's strength problem. There has been SOME playcalling problems. There have been some coaching the players up problems. The last one is obvious on the OL and at the QB position. Its a lot of everything. I do know that Roof needs to go. I will not say the same about Gus but he needs to unfuck this shit I saw Saturday. Total bull hockey.Whether its coaching, prep, playcalling, putting better players in the right places......something. Any fucking thing.


The offensive production in those blowout losses is totally unacceptable. We have a roster littered with great talent. Gus gets a ton of money to produce results. He has not this year. Chris Todd was not leaps and bounds better out of HS than Trotter or Moseley. Maybe slightly better at most. Are you telling me that Moseley, Trotter and Frazier all have the same affliction?? All at the same time? They just forgot how to play QB this season, all of them? Frazier was a blue chip recruit, Moseley doesnt have a ton of stars by his name but the guy was Mr. Football his Sr year. He did something right at some point.

I really just dont think Gus has adjusted well to Cam being gone. He needs to go back to the drawing board. This is his job, to figure this shit out. Summed up, we have 2 avg, mediocre QBs on the roster but that is no reason to get our shit pushed in as bad as we have. We should be losing games with those 2 at QB, not getting ass raped. There is a disconnect on multiple levels.

Trotter was supposed to be it.  He has the physical tools, but he simply wouldn't pull the trigger.  Why?  No earthly fucking idea.  Mosley, completely different.  Simply not an SEC level QB.   Simple as that. 

Frazier?  Jury still out.  Could be they were just scared to throw him to the wolves.  Coaches will fuck up from time to time.  Hell Peyton Manning was the #3 QB coming out of camp his Fr. year.  It took injuries to get him on the field.  Coaches are afflicted with being scared of Fr. even if they show well in practice, especially at QB.

Gus' offense is predicated on Running the set up play action passing.  When teams know you can't pass, then they sure aren't going to let you run.  Do you think since game 3 or 4 we've seen the same defenses we saw early season and last year?  Why would any DC make pass coverage a priority vs Auburn this year?

Gus is the same guy that overhauled his offense to make the most of Cam last year.  The offense morphed in to an option offense after the Clemson game. 

Bama shut us, and Cam, the fuck down in the first half last season, and he adjusted the offense at half. 

Sometimes, you simply don't have the players to do any of what you do.  Would the QB play have been better with a better OL?  Probably, but then again, if our QB was a threat to hit a pass beyond the line of scrimmage, the fronts we'd see would be more run friendly, and probably make the OL look a little better. 

I keep hearing or reading "this offense requires a player like Cam to function".  Bullshit.  People simply ignore what Todd was able to accomplish in this offense.  He's no Cam, and he set Auburn passing records, and people still call him a retard.  Well, stupid people do.  NO offense could function with the level of QB play we've gotten this year.  I don't give a fuck what scheme you put Mosley in, he'd fail vs SEC level competition. 

If you simply are tired of Gus, that's fine, it's your opinion, you're entitled to it.  You want a different looking scheme, fine too.    You're probably going to get your wish though, I expect Malzahn will get a suitable job offer, and if I were him, I'd tell the Auburn family that their ungrateful asses could choke on a bag of dicks. 

Roof?  Fuck him! 
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JR4AU

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Re: 2012 Projected starting lineup
« Reply #23 on: November 28, 2011, 12:52:41 PM »
If we do not go the Juco route at QB, I would not be surprised to see Trotter or Mosely back starting again next year. KF just did not seem to have that extra ummph to put him ahead of either of those guys. His running is not prolific, no explosiveness or elusiveness. And he cannot throw the ball. Unless he gets a lot quicker and learns to throw instead of float, he will not be the guy.
This being said, we have had years in the past where one of the starters from the previous season had a light come on and stepped up to the challenge. Will it happen again? Who knows.

I hate it's come to that, as that's not good for the long term, but damn, it would seem that they would certainly be looking for a JUCO QB. 
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Godfather

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Re: 2012 Projected starting lineup
« Reply #24 on: November 28, 2011, 01:01:46 PM »
Trotter was supposed to be it.  He has the physical tools, but he simply wouldn't pull the trigger.  Why?  No earthly fucking idea.  Mosley, completely different.  Simply not an SEC level QB.   Simple as that. 

Frazier?  Jury still out.  Could be they were just scared to throw him to the wolves.  Coaches will fuck up from time to time.  Hell Peyton Manning was the #3 QB coming out of camp his Fr. year.  It took injuries to get him on the field.  Coaches are afflicted with being scared of Fr. even if they show well in practice, especially at QB.

Gus' offense is predicated on Running the set up play action passing.  When teams know you can't pass, then they sure aren't going to let you run.  Do you think since game 3 or 4 we've seen the same defenses we saw early season and last year?  Why would any DC make pass coverage a priority vs Auburn this year?

Gus is the same guy that overhauled his offense to make the most of Cam last year.  The offense morphed in to an option offense after the Clemson game. 

Bama shut us, and Cam, the fuck down in the first half last season, and he adjusted the offense at half. 

Sometimes, you simply don't have the players to do any of what you do. Would the QB play have been better with a better OL?  Probably, but then again, if our QB was a threat to hit a pass beyond the line of scrimmage, the fronts we'd see would be more run friendly, and probably make the OL look a little better. 

I keep hearing or reading "this offense requires a player like Cam to function".  Bullshit.  People simply ignore what Todd was able to accomplish in this offense.  He's no Cam, and he set Auburn passing records, and people still call him a retard.  Well, stupid people do.  NO offense could function with the level of QB play we've gotten this year.  I don't give a fuck what scheme you put Mosley in, he'd fail vs SEC level competition. 

If you simply are tired of Gus, that's fine, it's your opinion, you're entitled to it.  You want a different looking scheme, fine too.    You're probably going to get your wish though, I expect Malzahn will get a suitable job offer, and if I were him, I'd tell the Auburn family that their ungrateful asses could choke on a bag of dicks. 

Roof?  Fuck him!
Problem with the above bolded...then we should have recruited what he needed before now.  3rd year in this cannot be an excuse.

and I agree that Gus has always been able to work with what he has.  The biggest difference between 09 and this year O-Line.  We had a good O-Line in 2009 this year we do not. That being said overall Gus has had some WTF play calls this year, but the bama game was an abomination of play calling and IMO was his fault. Was the team to blame yes...but the blame lies with the coaches first.

With regards to Frazier you simply cannot at this point say that he is a bust.  He is a true freshman, whom the coaches have sporadically allowed to pass usually in shitty situations. Playing behind the same shitty O-line.   Those that defend Moseley saying he hasn't gotten into a rythm cannot shit on Frazier because he also hasn't been allowed to get into any rythm.  Could he be Kodi Burns at QB? sure...but remember it also took Jason Campbell 2-3 years to "get it" he gets a pass IMO.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2011, 01:03:00 PM by Godfather »
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JR4AU

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Re: 2012 Projected starting lineup
« Reply #25 on: November 28, 2011, 01:17:46 PM »
Problem with the above bolded...then we should have recruited what he needed before now.  3rd year in this cannot be an excuse.

and I agree that Gus has always been able to work with what he has.  The biggest difference between 09 and this year O-Line.  We had a good O-Line in 2009 this year we do not. That being said overall Gus has had some WTF play calls this year, but the bama game was an abomination of play calling and IMO was his fault. Was the team to blame yes...but the blame lies with the coaches first.

With regards to Frazier you simply cannot at this point say that he is a bust.  He is a true freshman, whom the coaches have sporadically allowed to pass usually in shitty situations. Playing behind the same shitty O-line.   Those that defend Moseley saying he hasn't gotten into a rythm cannot shit on Frazier because he also hasn't been allowed to get into any rythm.  Could he be Kodi Burns at QB? sure...but remember it also took Jason Campbell 2-3 years to "get it" he gets a pass IMO.

So, good coaches never miss on QBs?  By the way, Trotter was a Tuberville recruit.  Talented, or supposedly talented QBs never bust?  They went and got one last year, because of what we see this year.    They went after Wilson for same reasons, and couldn't land him.  They knew we didn't have a QB.  They landed the Rollison kid who turned out to be some sort of problem.  They recruited Mosley simply to claim a recruiting win by landing "Mr Football" and to have as an emergency back up.  I don't think they ever thought he'd be a starter.  Trotter is truly a bust in my book, and I think they thought he'd at least be serviceable.   

I'm not calling Frazier a bust at all, just fearful he's not all they'd hoped he'd be.
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Re: 2012 Projected starting lineup
« Reply #26 on: November 28, 2011, 01:27:56 PM »
So, good coaches never miss on QBs?  By the way, Trotter was a Tuberville recruit.  Talented, or supposedly talented QBs never bust?  They went and got one last year, because of what we see this year.    They went after Wilson for same reasons, and couldn't land him.  They knew we didn't have a QB.  They landed the Rollison kid who turned out to be some sort of problem.  They recruited Mosley simply to claim a recruiting win by landing "Mr Football" and to have as an emergency back up.  I don't think they ever thought he'd be a starter.  Trotter is truly a bust in my book, and I think they thought he'd at least be serviceable.   

I'm not calling Frazier a bust at all, just fearful he's not all they'd hoped he'd be.

Mr. Football won the starting job over Frazier, and was at least as serviceable as Trotter.  Once Trotter lost his confidence in the OL, and his ability to get the ball down-field, it was over for him. 

Nobody was going to look like a superstar while being chased around by defensive linemen collapsing every pocket due to an under-developed and young OL.  It's also the reason the multiple hand-offs and play action plays didn't work nearly to even average levels.

Malzhan showed stubbornness this year, rather than the adjusting guru we needed him to be this year.  Frazier and Pike could be, and should be a much stronger battle next season, with a game tested and more mature Moseley right there in the mix as well.

More importantly, regardless of OC?  The OL will be more mature, stronger and at least give a fractional boost to what they were able to do this year.  That can't be ignored, regardless of scheme, system...or whatever.
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JR4AU

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Re: 2012 Projected starting lineup
« Reply #27 on: November 28, 2011, 01:33:11 PM »
Mr. Football won the starting job over Frazier, and was at least as serviceable as Trotter.  Once Trotter lost his confidence in the OL, and his ability to get the ball down-field, it was over for him. 

Nobody was going to look like a superstar while being chased around by defensive linemen collapsing every pocket due to an under-developed and young OL.  It's also the reason the multiple hand-offs and play action plays didn't work nearly to even average levels.

Malzhan showed stubbornness this year, rather than the adjusting guru we needed him to be this year.  Frazier and Pike could be, and should be a much stronger battle next season, with a game tested and more mature Moseley right there in the mix as well.

More importantly, regardless of OC?  The OL will be more mature, stronger and at least give a fractional boost to what they were able to do this year.  That can't be ignored, regardless of scheme, system...or whatever.

Pretty much agree with all that.  I hope, I hope, Frazier is good enough.
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JR4AU

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Re: 2012 Projected starting lineup
« Reply #28 on: November 28, 2011, 01:46:45 PM »


My projection:
OFFENSE
QB - Kyle Frazier (So)
RB - Michael Dyer  (Jr)
HB - Phillip Lutzenkirchen  (Sr)
WR - Emory Blake  (Sr)
WR - Trovon Reed  (rSo)
WR - Travante Stallworth (Sr)
LT - Greg Robinson  (rFr)
LG - Chad Slade  (Jr)
C - Reese Dismukes  (So)
RG -  Eric Mack  (rFr)
RT - Christian Westerman  (rFr)




I don't claim to have skreetz, but have heard rumor that Eric Mack struggles to keep his weight down, and I don't see how he'd overtake a Sr. in John Sullen if he's not a whole lot better. 

Also, don't forget that Shon Coleman will likely compete for a spot at RT or LT. 

I may have heard the same bad rumors about Aubry Phillips too.  A 4 star Soph that's never seen the field, and is listed as 6-5 336.

Ed Christian may compete for a spot too.  The OL could look completely different next year. 
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djsimp

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Re: 2012 Projected starting lineup
« Reply #29 on: November 28, 2011, 01:53:40 PM »
I believe I have read that it will be the 2013 before Coleman gets a nod.
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AUTiger1

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Re: 2012 Projected starting lineup
« Reply #30 on: November 28, 2011, 01:56:00 PM »
I don't claim to have skreetz, but have heard rumor that Eric Mack struggles to keep his weight down, and I don't see how he'd overtake a Sr. in John Sullen if he's not a whole lot better. 

Also, don't forget that Shon Coleman will likely compete for a spot at RT or LT. 

I may have heard the same bad rumors about Aubry Phillips too.  A 4 star Soph that's never seen the field, and is listed as 6-5 336.

Ed Christian may compete for a spot too.  The OL could look completely different next year.

Phillips is gone, as is Christian.  Coleman according to one of the premium sites will not be playing until 2013 if he ever gets to play.   He will sit and apply for an extra year for medical reasons and will more than likely get it.
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Courage is only fear holding on a minute longer.--George S. Patton

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Buzz Killington

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Re: 2012 Projected starting lineup
« Reply #31 on: November 28, 2011, 01:57:48 PM »
I don't claim to have skreetz, but have heard rumor that Eric Mack struggles to keep his weight down, and I don't see how he'd overtake a Sr. in John Sullen if he's not a whole lot better. 

Also, don't forget that Shon Coleman will likely compete for a spot at RT or LT. 

I may have heard the same bad rumors about Aubry Phillips too.  A 4 star Soph that's never seen the field, and is listed as 6-5 336.

Ed Christian may compete for a spot too.  The OL could look completely different next year.
Actually, that was an error on my part anyway...I completely forgot about Sullen. 
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JR4AU

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Re: 2012 Projected starting lineup
« Reply #32 on: November 28, 2011, 01:58:36 PM »
Phillips is gone, as is Christian.  Coleman according to one of the premium sites will not be playing until 2013 if he ever gets to play.   He will sit and apply for an extra year for medical reasons and will more than likely get it.

Fuck sakes, rivals needs to update the roster, and I need to read the paper more!
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Snaggletiger

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Re: 2012 Projected starting lineup
« Reply #33 on: November 28, 2011, 02:05:10 PM »
I have one hope only for next year with our offensive line, and that's that they decided to try and make it through and not burn the Westerman and Robinson redshirts.  I saw the two walking the sidelines Saturday and Westerman is noticably bigger than the 277 he came in at.  Robinson looks like a frickin' beast.  Having said that, I have no real expectations for the O-line.  Why would they be any better?   
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Godfather

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Re: 2012 Projected starting lineup
« Reply #34 on: November 28, 2011, 02:07:03 PM »
I have one hope only for next year with our offensive line, and that's that they decided to try and make it through and not burn the Westerman and Robinson redshirts.  I saw the two walking the sidelines Saturday and Westerman is noticably bigger than the 277 he came in at.  Robinson looks like a frickin' beast.  Having said that, I have no real expectations for the O-line.  Why would they be any better?
Couldn't be worse...right? right?
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JR4AU

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Re: 2012 Projected starting lineup
« Reply #35 on: November 28, 2011, 02:08:17 PM »
I have one hope only for next year with our offensive line, and that's that they decided to try and make it through and not burn the Westerman and Robinson redshirts.  I saw the two walking the sidelines Saturday and Westerman is noticably bigger than the 277 he came in at.  Robinson looks like a frickin' beast.  Having said that, I have no real expectations for the O-line.  Why would they be any better?

If you are in the "youth isn't an excuse" crowd, then you're right, they're as good as they'll ever be as freshmen. 
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Re: 2012 Projected starting lineup
« Reply #36 on: November 28, 2011, 02:09:03 PM »
I have one hope only for next year with our offensive line, and that's that they decided to try and make it through and not burn the Westerman and Robinson redshirts.  I saw the two walking the sidelines Saturday and Westerman is noticably bigger than the 277 he came in at.  Robinson looks like a frickin' beast.  Having said that, I have no real expectations for the O-line.  Why would they be any better?

Dismukes is going to be a monster, and have a full season of "know how" under his belt. It's going to help him tremendously I believe.  Having a good experienced center is a good start to some sort of improvement.  Should also be a plus for any of the QB's that end up with the starter's job.
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AUTiger1

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Re: 2012 Projected starting lineup
« Reply #37 on: November 28, 2011, 02:10:41 PM »
Fuck sakes, rivals needs to update the roster, and I need to read the paper more!

Phillips and Christian were gone on medical early this season.

Next year we have Robinson, Westerman, Slade, Sullen, Mack, O'Riley, Dismukes, Burgess, Fairmekkalekkahighlekkahineyho or what ever his name is and our big beastly Somalian/Tongan warrrior who should be able to play immediately.  That is all I can think of off the top of my head.   

We should be a little better.  Latu should be able to come in and compete.  Hopefully Robinson and Westerman took/takes advantage of the RS year in the weight room and studying film.  Sullen should provide some experience.  Hopefully we get a surprise in someone like O'Riley.
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Godfather

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Re: 2012 Projected starting lineup
« Reply #38 on: November 28, 2011, 02:11:46 PM »
If you are in the "youth isn't an excuse" crowd, then you're right, they're as good as they'll ever be as freshmen.
Youth is an excuse, it's just not the only one especially after 12 games.
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Buzz Killington

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Re: 2012 Projected starting lineup
« Reply #39 on: November 28, 2011, 02:13:25 PM »
Phillips and Christian were gone on medical early this season.

Next year we have Robinson, Westerman, Slade, Sullen, Mack, O'Riley, Dismukes, Burgess, Fairmekkalekkahighlekkahineyho or what ever his name is and our big beastly Somalian/Tongan warrrior who should be able to play immediately.  That is all I can think of off the top of my head.   

We should be a little better.  Latu should be able to come in and compete.  Hopefully Robinson and Westerman took/takes advantage of the RS year in the weight room and studying film.  Sullen should provide some experience.  Hopefully we get a surprise in someone like O'Riley.

Still scary as hell to think of starting 2 redshirt freshman tackles.  Looks like Dyer will get a bunch of carries next season...
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Now I may be an idiot, but there is one thing I am not, sir, and that, sir, is an idiot.