What worries me the most

[Kaos]

Yeah, the defensive problems worry me.  They worry me greatly.  So does a murderous October schedule that (if things don't spin quickly) could have us struggling to break even this year. 

What worries me the most is that I've seen a gigaton of our people who are ready and willing to write off whatever happens this season due to their fervent belief that 2012 is going to be a championship type year. 

Here's the thing that gnaws at me about that.  The defense shows the same wide-eyed fucked-up capacity it did in 2009.  By most standards it wasn't even adequate last year.  An offense that puts up 41 a game covers a lot of flaws. 

Two straight seasons Auburn has given up more than 330 points.  No team before 2009 had ever surrendered 300.  Three games in, this defense has coughed up 110.  A quarter of the way through the season and 110 points.  On pace for giving up 400. 

You can look back through history and find several Tuberville teams where two years combined didn't give up 300.  In Dye's time, three combined didn't give up much over 300. 

This is deeper than "youth" It's much more than "experience."  Three years is a trend.  It's a track record. 

I'm saying now (and you can write this down) that if there isn't a significant change in defensive strategy, fundamentals and (yes) coaching those 2012 dreams are nothing but delusional fantasies.  We won't be good in 2012 or 2013 or 2014 so long as the defense performs this poorly.  And I'm not talking about Clemson.  I'm talking about Arkansas State, Arkansas, Alabama, Georgia, Mississippi State, South Carolina, Utah State, West Virginia, Northwestern, Kentucky.........

If that makes me a bad fan or means I'm not "all in"  so be it.   Maybe we should have been raising some alarms and pointing out the obvious even when winning was all we did.  Maybe winning wasn't enough.  Maybe, just maybe, we fucked ourselves long term for (really awesome and much savored) short-term glory. 

Just thinking out loud here, but if we don't come back from Georgia's opening punch, if we don't drive 99 yards in 30 plays against Kentucky and if the Ewok hangs on to the ball and T-Town Trent catches a wide open pass in Tuscaloosa would we today be looking at a revamped defensive staff and a still churning offense that could light it up for three or four years running? 

[JR4AU]

Yeah, the defensive problems worry me.  They worry me greatly.  So does a murderous October schedule that (if things don't spin quickly) could have us struggling to break even this year. 

What worries me the most is that I've seen a gigaton of our people who are ready and willing to write off whatever happens this season due to their fervent belief that 2012 is going to be a championship type year. 

Here's the thing that gnaws at me about that.  The defense shows the same wide-eyed fucked-up capacity it did in 2009.  By most standards it wasn't even adequate last year.  An offense that puts up 41 a game covers a lot of flaws. 

Two straight seasons Auburn has given up more than 330 points.  No team before 2009 had ever surrendered 300.  Three games in, this defense has coughed up 110.  A quarter of the way through the season and 110 points.  On pace for giving up 400. 

You can look back through history and find several Tuberville teams where two years combined didn't give up 300.  In Dye's time, three combined didn't give up much over 300. 

This is deeper than "youth" It's much more than "experience."  Three years is a trend.  It's a track record. 

I'm saying now (and you can write this down) that if there isn't a significant change in defensive strategy, fundamentals and (yes) coaching those 2012 dreams are nothing but delusional fantasies.  We won't be good in 2012 or 2013 or 2014 so long as the defense performs this poorly.  And I'm not talking about Clemson.  I'm talking about Arkansas State, Arkansas, Alabama, Georgia, Mississippi State, South Carolina, Utah State, West Virginia, Northwestern, Kentucky.........

If that makes me a bad fan or means I'm not "all in"  so be it.   Maybe we should have been raising some alarms and pointing out the obvious even when winning was all we did.  Maybe winning wasn't enough.  Maybe, just maybe, we fucked ourselves long term for (really awesome and much savored) short-term glory. 

Just thinking out loud here, but if we don't come back from Georgia's opening punch, if we don't drive 99 yards in 30 plays against Kentucky and if the Ewok hangs on to the ball and T-Town Trent catches a wide open pass in Tuscaloosa would we today be looking at a revamped defensive staff and a still churning offense that could light it up for three or four years running?

^^^THIS^^^  Fucking all of it, every stinking word of it! 

I'll add...it's not sucking that bothers me as much as continuing to do the things that suck hoping for a different result. 

[GH2001]

Yeah, the defensive problems worry me.  They worry me greatly.  So does a murderous October schedule that (if things don't spin quickly) could have us struggling to break even this year. 

What worries me the most is that I've seen a gigaton of our people who are ready and willing to write off whatever happens this season due to their fervent belief that 2012 is going to be a championship type year. 

Here's the thing that gnaws at me about that.  The defense shows the same wide-eyed fucked-up capacity it did in 2009.  By most standards it wasn't even adequate last year.  An offense that puts up 41 a game covers a lot of flaws. 

Two straight seasons Auburn has given up more than 330 points.  No team before 2009 had ever surrendered 300.  Three games in, this defense has coughed up 110.  A quarter of the way through the season and 110 points.  On pace for giving up 400. 

You can look back through history and find several Tuberville teams where two years combined didn't give up 300.  In Dye's time, three combined didn't give up much over 300. 

This is deeper than "youth" It's much more than "experience."  Three years is a trend.  It's a track record. 

I'm saying now (and you can write this down) that if there isn't a significant change in defensive strategy, fundamentals and (yes) coaching those 2012 dreams are nothing but delusional fantasies.  We won't be good in 2012 or 2013 or 2014 so long as the defense performs this poorly.  And I'm not talking about Clemson.  I'm talking about Arkansas State, Arkansas, Alabama, Georgia, Mississippi State, South Carolina, Utah State, West Virginia, Northwestern, Kentucky.........

If that makes me a bad fan or means I'm not "all in"  so be it.   Maybe we should have been raising some alarms and pointing out the obvious even when winning was all we did.  Maybe winning wasn't enough.  Maybe, just maybe, we fucked ourselves long term for (really awesome and much savored) short-term glory. 

Just thinking out loud here, but if we don't come back from Georgia's opening punch, if we don't drive 99 yards in 30 plays against Kentucky and if the Ewok hangs on to the ball and T-Town Trent catches a wide open pass in Tuscaloosa would we today be looking at a revamped defensive staff and a still churning offense that could light it up for three or four years running?

Agree.

A Cam Newton to eat up clock and bail us out of busted plays helped the D stay off the field last year. That helps to cover flaws.

A Nick Fairley and Zack Clayton to plug the gaps and pressure the QBs almost every play, helps to cover flaws.

A Josh Bynes and Zac Etheredge providing Sr. leadership, helped to cover the flaws.

Ted Roof has none of that this year to cover his sorry ass. He had those mulligans last year. He has young talent this year and he can't do a Got-damned thing with it.

Fuck him in da mouf.

[Yoda]

To add to our defensive problems, jus t wait until Malzahn gets a head coaching job.  When he is gone our offense will slide back a little and we damn sure better have a different defense by that time, if not it will be long season after long season.  I really believe that our defense will not get better until our offense forces it to get better.

[jmar]

^^^THIS^^^  Fucking all of it, every stinking word of it! 

I'll add...it's not sucking that bothers me as much as continuing to do the things that suck hoping for a different result.

Look I love offense, the more the better. But other than the Mississippi teams, we might have a linebacker that could break in one of the remaining west team's two deep, MAYBE.
We recruit skill players for offense better than the rest. But the shortfall at LB has been a problem since '08.

I realize we lost Frost to a spring injury and Evans was a late scratch on Saturday but we don't have enough talent at these positions.

Don't know how you teach a four star to make open field tackles but how is it that our main competitor has no problems defending the pass while our guys are totally lost?

It's no time to pack it in. Chizik needs to take the defensive reins and demote Roof.

Defense used to be an Auburn hallmark and now it's the laughing stock of college football. 

[JR4AU]

Look I love offense, the more the better. But other than the Mississippi teams, we might have a linebacker that could break in one of the remaining west team's two deep, MAYBE.
We recruit skill players for offense better than the rest. But the shortfall at LB has been a problem since '08.

I realize we lost Frost to a spring injury and Evans was a late scratch on Saturday but we don't have enough talent at these positions.

Don't know how you teach a four star to make open field tackles but how is it that our main competitor has no problems defending the pass while our guys are totally lost?

It's no time to pack it in. Chizik needs to take the defensive reins and demote Roof.

Defense used to be an Auburn hallmark and now it's the laughing stock of college football.

Holland and Freeman were both 4* recruits.  Bates was a 2 star, but SEC Fr. of the year (or some shit like that...not sure) 2 years ago at S, then moved down to LB.  The rest are 3* solid "should contribute" type players.  It's not a lack of talent. 

[jmar]

Holland and Freeman were both 4* recruits.  Bates was a 2 star, but SEC Fr. of the year (or some shit like that...not sure) 2 years ago at S, then moved down to LB.  The rest are 3* solid "should contribute" type players.  It's not a lack of talent.

Gus might have run Dyer more but chose not to. The man knows what he is doing. He just helped expose the problem which was so very evident to all of us. It's Chizik's problem to fix.

[Townhallsavoy]

NO NO NO NO NO NO NO.

Absolutely wrong. 

Won in the short term and fucked ourselves in the long term?

I don't buy that at all.  Gene Chizik is a championship caliber coach.  He's proved he can win a BCS national championship which is a team effort.  To say it was all Cam and all luck is unfair to Chizik and unfair to logic. 

Now, I'm not saying he gets an excuse for this shitty defense.  Not at all. 

But he knows how to win a trophy.  The real question is does he have it in him to make the necessary changes to get it done? 

Because while Roof was a hindrance to our season last every year, Chizik is the guy who pulled this team through some of the worst adversity I've ever seen. 

Until something comes out linking Chizik directly to the defensive woes - as in he doesn't let Roof do his job - I'll continue to give him my full support. 

We aren't at the "Oh shit" mark yet. 

[JR4AU]

NO NO NO NO NO NO NO.

Absolutely wrong. 

Won in the short term and fucked ourselves in the long term?

I don't buy that at all.  Gene Chizik is a championship caliber coach.  He's proved he can win a BCS national championship which is a team effort.  To say it was all Cam and all luck is unfair to Chizik and unfair to logic. 

Now, I'm not saying he gets an excuse for this shitty defense.  Not at all. 

But he knows how to win a trophy.  The real question is does he have it in him to make the necessary changes to get it done? 

Because while Roof was a hindrance to our season last every year, Chizik is the guy who pulled this team through some of the worst adversity I've ever seen. 

Until something comes out linking Chizik directly to the defensive woes - as in he doesn't let Roof do his job - I'll continue to give him my full support. 

We aren't at the "Oh shit" mark yet.

I don't care how we won the BCS, we won it.  But, it also saved Roof.  Not Chiz, Roof.  And yes, we're at the oh shit mark with a D THIS bad. 

[The Prowler]

We're doomed...the sky is falling!!!

[Kaos]

The "oh shit" balloon went airborne after 505 yards against West Virginia in 2009.  It got a little air with 410 against UT and then 495 against Arkansas.  600-plus yards against Northwestern inflated it a little more.  Nine teams scored 24 or more against AU that year. 

2010?  Five teams racked more than 400 yards.  Five. Nine more teams in 2010 scored 24 or more against AU.

In two seasons and three games, 21 teams have scored 24 or more points.  That 70%.  70% of the time AU gives up at least three touchdowns. 

2008 -- and we all agree it was the worst year we could remember -- only three teams broke 400 against AU.  Two of those were the worst losses of the season -- WVU and UA.   Only four teams scored 24 or more. 

Go back to 2007.  Three teams scored 24 or more.  AU gave up 25 total touchdowns in 2007.  Three games into 2011 and 14 have already been scored.  Over halfway to the season total just four years ago. 


In 2005 David Gibbs' AU defense was sixth nationally in scoring defense.  It led the SEC in sacks.  His ass got fired because it wasn't performing up to AU standards.  Gave up 24 or more just three times.  Think about that. 

Nobody is saying we're eternally doomed.  Nobody is saying the sky is falling.  But the "oh shit" balloon has wings.  As magnificent as the offense is under Gus, the defense is equally appalling under Roof.  For every offensive record we set, we're setting two new lows for defense.  It was that way in 2009. It was that way last season.  It's that way now.  Pretending it's not or refusing to acknowledge it won't make it go away. 

This, to me, is where we truly find out what Chizik is made of.  Does he have the nuts to fix it?  Tuberville was never afraid to burn the house down.  Most of the time it worked:  Petrino, Chizik, Muschamp, Borges.   Sometimes it didn't: Nallsminger, Franklin.  But he was never unwilling to try to fix what he perceived as broken. 

[Townhallsavoy]

I don't care how we won the BCS, we won it.  But, it also saved Roof.  Not Chiz, Roof.  And yes, we're at the oh shit mark with a D THIS bad.

I mean the "Oh shit the head coach sucks and we're going to blow for the next five years" mark. 

Isn't that what K is saying? 

I don't think that's the case.  If Chizik doesn't do something to change this defense, we're screwed for a long time.  But I have faith in Gene.  I fully expect him to turn this program back in the right direction.

[Kaos]

I mean the "Oh shit the head coach sucks and we're going to blow for the next five years" mark. 

Isn't that what K is saying? 

I don't think that's the case.  If Chizik doesn't do something to change this defense, we're screwed for a long time.  But I have faith in Gene.  I fully expect him to turn this program back in the right direction.

Not what I'm saying at all.  You're reading a different book. 

What I'm saying is that the glow of winning kept us from acknowledging some spectacular flaws that have been there since 2009.   It's like we had an enormous pulsing zit on our face but we were able to cover it up with some base and concealer.  But the damn thing done busted now. 

I'm saying that if a game or three last year had turned out differently I don't think we'd be having this discussion because (I truly believe) we'd have a radically different defensive staff this year. 

Will I take a year of sucking in exchange for what last season gave me?  Sure. It was priceless.  And part of that was the way we won. But as I reflect back I think...  we had one of the greatest offensive weapons in the history of the game.  We had a strong offensive line.  One of the best freshman backs in the best league in the country.  Quality possession receivers.  The top offensive mind in the game. We should have fucking dominated the landscape.  But we didn't.  We had to scrap, scrape, dig and brawl.  Why?  Because nine teams scored 24 or more on Auburn last year.  And they did it against a line that had one of the best players in the country. 

FWIW?   I think we made a mistake letting Rock to go Tennessee.  I think AU would be improved if he were DC, but what do I know?

Would I trade three or four years of abject defensive misery (if something isn't done to rectify this) in exchange for the past glorious season?  I'd have to think about it.  Maybe not. 

What I'm saying is I wonder if a loss or two and a complete overhaul of the defensive staff (philosophy) might have been better for the long haul.   Win the NC in 2010 or possibly win two in 2012 and 13 before Gus takes his show on the road as a headliner?  (He has to eventually, you know that.  Two words are all you need to know about that subject: Norm Chow. )   

The current state can't be ignored.  This is the worst Auburn defense I've ever seen.  This is the third year I've found myself saying that.  Last year I said it and then had the luxury of dancing to All I Do Is Win at the end. 

For the record it should be noted that I have absolutely no emotion.  I'm not bitching, either.  I'm just asking questions and thinking out loud. 

[JR4AU]

FWIW?   I think we made a mistake letting Rock to go Tennessee.  I think AU would be improved if he were DC, but what do I know?

Offer him the DC job, and $1Mil.  He'll leave the NFL. 

[jmar]

Offer him the DC job, and $1Mil.  He'll leave the NFL.

I think Pelton is a very good d-line coach along the lines of Rocker.

But I don't think our inability to tackle or defend the pass has anything to do with our defensive scheme or Roof having us in the wrong formation. He has demonstrated a knack to dial it up when  it counts in past games. Chizik would know the formation and coverage anyway.

Playing ten+ yards off a receiver is conceeding. It says we can't cover you , we only hope to contain you.

WE CAN DO NO WORSE PLAYING STRAIGHT MAN. NO WORSE!

We also have witnessed and there were several comments made last season that beyond our inability to tackle in open field, our linebackers are challenged when it comes to coverage skills.

I am by no means a coach but I have listened well enough to those that have to have a clue. And my answer is to get the DBs and LBs out of the classroom and onto the field with anyone that can run a route. Run the exact second half script of the Clemson loss every day substituting man coverage. The coaches have to point out the signs that receivers give when a ball is upon them.(slowing, stutter step, widening eyes etc...It's ridiculous sounding but its true. After one thousand four you better close in and turn your hips with your hands up in one motion to have a chance. It's the most difficult position to learn and play well on the field besides QB. Defenders have to be able to recognize these signs. Corners have to have an internal clock running as they track a receiver. That's a lot of isolated shit going on at one time...and why young corners get tested early and often by veterans.

Opposing teams are going to use our first three defensive debacles to slice and dice us from here on out. We are passable up front, below average at LB and miserable in the secondary. But it's all compounded and magnified when we can't get off blocks, blow coverage or whiff a ball carrier on 3rd and long plays. 

And we won't see batted balls or picks until we start playing aggressive man because it's almost like stealing the way a "good to decent" QB can take three receivers and undress us. It's worse when they have a large mobile RB in the fold and a fucking track star on the field just for kicks. Yeah it's AUBURN with a goddamned lake!

We will see more tackles, pull-downs and interferrence penalties because we will be in the same zip code as the receiver. But I will trade that over giving them the ball for a lay-up any day.

We are 2-1 with nine regular season games to go minus the "confidence builder" with Florda Atlantic and the Samford win to come. Auburn has seven SEC opponents on the schedule and will we be underdogs in all but one game  At this point, I will call this season a success if we can somehow overcome our defensive woes against the likes of South Carolina,  Florida, Ole Miss and Georgia. And if not for Malzahn I wouldn't like Auburn in most of these games.

I don't think man coverage is the total solution...but it's a step toward changing how offensive coordinators will attack us in the future. If we are closer, we have a better chance to make a tackle.

 

 

[JR4AU]

I think Pelton is a very good d-line coach along the lines of Rocker.

But I don't think our inability to tackle or defend the pass has anything to do with our defensive scheme or Roof having us in the wrong formation. He has demonstrated a knack to dial it up when  it counts in past games. Chizik would know the formation and coverage anyway.

Playing ten+ yards off a receiver is conceeding. It says we can't cover you , we only hope to contain you.

WE CAN DO NO WORSE PLAYING STRAIGHT MAN. NO WORSE!

We also have witnessed and there were several comments made last season that beyond our inability to tackle in open field, our linebackers are challenged when it comes to coverage skills.

I am by no means a coach but I have listened well enough to those that have to have a clue. And my answer is to get the DBs and LBs out of the classroom and onto the field with anyone that can run a route. Run the exact second half script of the Clemson loss every day substituting man coverage. The coaches have to point out the signs that receivers give when a ball is upon them.(slowing, stutter step, widening eyes etc...It's ridiculous sounding but its true. After one thousand four you better close in and turn your hips with your hands up in one motion to have a chance. It's the most difficult position to learn and play well on the field besides QB. Defenders have to be able to recognize these signs. Corners have to have an internal clock running as they track a receiver. That's a lot of isolated shit going on at one time...and why young corners get tested early and often by veterans.

Opposing teams are going to use our first three defensive debacles to slice and dice us from here on out. We are passable up front, below average at LB and miserable in the secondary. But it's all compounded and magnified when we can't get off blocks, blow coverage or whiff a ball carrier on 3rd and long plays. 

And we won't see batted balls or picks until we start playing aggressive man because it's almost like stealing the way a "good to decent" QB can take three receivers and undress us. It's worse when they have a large mobile RB in the fold and a fucking track star on the field just for kicks. Yeah it's AUBURN with a goddamned lake!

We will see more tackles, pull-downs and interferrence penalties because we will be in the same zip code as the receiver. But I will trade that over giving them the ball for a lay-up any day.

We are 2-1 with nine regular season games to go minus the "confidence builder" with Florda Atlantic and the Samford win to come. Auburn has seven SEC opponents on the schedule and will we be underdogs in all but one game  At this point, I will call this season a success if we can somehow overcome our defensive woes against the likes of South Carolina,  Florida, Ole Miss and Georgia. And if not for Malzahn I wouldn't like Auburn in most of these games.

I don't think man coverage is the total solution...but it's a step toward changing how offensive coordinators will attack us in the future. If we are closer, we have a better chance to make a tackle.

 

We play a shit ton of man as it is now.  We play Zone, Man, and Combo pretty much equally sucky. 

[Townhallsavoy]

We play a shit ton of man as it is now.  We play Zone, Man, and Combo pretty much equally sucky.

Yep. 

Even when it does work, we don't tackle.

[Snaggletiger]

FWIW, Rocker was our line coach while we were giving up all those points the last two years.  Not saying it's him or wasn't him, but the problem obviously goes deeper and rests on overall defensive philosophy and the fundamentals of tackling.  I'm no coach and I don't study film so I can't speak to what particular defensive set we should run in this situation or that.  But I do think I'm smart enough to see a disturbing trend in the way this club has always tackled under Chizik/Roof. 

Josh Bynes talked about that very thing last year, saying there are no fundamentals, no actual tackling and everybody wants to make the big hit..."knock" somebody down or try to submarine the runner.  How hard is it to teach that....demand that?  Anyone who heard Q on the post game show heard him rail on how horrible the tackling is.  I keep hearing how physical the last two weeks of practice have been..we need to be a more "physical" team.  Well Coach, you can scheme and blitz and do all that coaching shit you want to put your guys in a position to make plays.  But it doesn't do a whole lot of good if the guys can't tackle when they do get there. 

Oh...and isn't 2+ years of defensive backs not turning around to look for the ball, enough?   

[GH2001]

The "oh shit" balloon went airborne after 505 yards against West Virginia in 2009.  It got a little air with 410 against UT and then 495 against Arkansas.  600-plus yards against Northwestern inflated it a little more.  Nine teams scored 24 or more against AU that year. 

2010?  Five teams racked more than 400 yards.  Five. Nine more teams in 2010 scored 24 or more against AU.

In two seasons and three games, 21 teams have scored 24 or more points.  That 70%.  70% of the time AU gives up at least three touchdowns. 

2008 -- and we all agree it was the worst year we could remember -- only three teams broke 400 against AU.  Two of those were the worst losses of the season -- WVU and UA.   Only four teams scored 24 or more. 

Go back to 2007.  Three teams scored 24 or more.  AU gave up 25 total touchdowns in 2007.  Three games into 2011 and 14 have already been scored.  Over halfway to the season total just four years ago. 


In 2005 David Gibbs' AU defense was sixth nationally in scoring defense.  It led the SEC in sacks.  His ass got fired because it wasn't performing up to AU standards.  Gave up 24 or more just three times.  Think about that. 

Nobody is saying we're eternally doomed.  Nobody is saying the sky is falling.  But the "oh shit" balloon has wings.  As magnificent as the offense is under Gus, the defense is equally appalling under Roof.  For every offensive record we set, we're setting two new lows for defense.  It was that way in 2009. It was that way last season.  It's that way now.  Pretending it's not or refusing to acknowledge it won't make it go away. 

This, to me, is where we truly find out what Chizik is made of.  Does he have the nuts to fix it?  Tuberville was never afraid to burn the house down.  Most of the time it worked:  Petrino, Chizik, Muschamp, Borges.   Sometimes it didn't: Nallsminger, Franklin.  But he was never unwilling to try to fix what he perceived as broken.

Tubs' last recruiting class should be out there on the field now as Seniors. I don't see many of them out there. That last class was a gap. We have absolutely no leadership on the field, like a Bynes or Etheredge. Not saying this is the issue, but it doesn't help. Youth is no excuse, as you've mentioned, Fla and Clemson seem to be doing fine with it. But it also doesn't help that we have no freaking leadership out there. No voice at all. Its just a bunch of lost puppies following each other.

[Saniflush]

Oh...and isn't 2+ years of defensive backs not turning around to look for the ball, enough?

See I'm with you on this one but I am constantly told that that's not how it's taught now.  You play face to the receiver now.  I don't agree with it but that's what everyone keeps telling me how it's taught now.