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This whole debt ceiling thing

Re: This whole debt ceiling thing
« Reply #40 on: August 11, 2011, 12:54:37 PM »
Now you prepare that Fetzer valve with some 3-in-1 oil and some gauze pads. And I'm gonna need 'bout ten quarts of anti-freeze, preferably Prestone.
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Snaggletiger

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Re: This whole debt ceiling thing
« Reply #41 on: August 11, 2011, 01:00:05 PM »
Now you prepare that Fetzer valve with some 3-in-1 oil and some gauze pads. And I'm gonna need 'bout ten quarts of anti-freeze, preferably Prestone.

Ball bearings?
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Saniflush

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Re: This whole debt ceiling thing
« Reply #42 on: August 11, 2011, 01:41:27 PM »
Ball bearings?

Oh, it's all ball bearings these days.
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"Hey my friends are the ones that wanted to eat at that shitty hole in the wall that only served bread and wine.  What kind of brick and mud business model is that.  Stick to the cart if that's all you're going to serve.  Then that dude came in with like 12 other people, and some of them weren't even wearing shoes, and the restaurant sat them right across from us. It was gross, and they were all stinky and dirty.  Then dude starts talking about eating his body and drinking his blood...I almost lost it.  That's the last supper I'll ever have there, and I hope he dies a horrible death."

GH2001

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Re: This whole debt ceiling thing
« Reply #43 on: August 11, 2011, 03:28:28 PM »
That's probably why so much of the citizen spending in the country isn't real currency but borrowed also.

I think you missed the context. People with jobs earning wages, spending that money in the retail arena and the trickle down effect it has from a macro perspective. When I say borrowed, I mean the govt borrowing more money from the fed and throwing it at the problem. It's not the natural way a free economy works. Yes, people on a micro level borrow too much, aka credit cards, etc.  My point was that jobs create wages which is spent and stimulates the economy which creates more jobs.
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GarMan

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Re: This whole debt ceiling thing
« Reply #44 on: August 11, 2011, 04:35:14 PM »
But, is that a bad thing? Sure, it's bad that people are out of jobs. Which means they are probably depending on some sort of government subsidy. But what were those jobs? Were those jobs that were created in the fist place for some bullUAT reason that wasn't even needed, thus considered expendable? That's where I'm coming from. Maybe that is the job market stabilizing itself in the correct way. Maybe that is a sign that companies are putting forth better operating plans, to where they have realized consumers aren't spending as much, so they don't need as much workforce. Like it or not, unemployment is a portion of what a free market economy is. How right would it be for the government to again throw a bunch of money (that doesn't exist, mind you) to create jobs based on.....nothing. Companies just hiring people to, again, do something meaningless that the company doesn't even need. How does that make things better in the long run?

That's kind of my entire point, really. Sorry if I'm being confusing. We have learned that throwing money at this whole thing will not fix it. It won't create lasting jobs. It won't fix things long term. It is a waste. And all at the same time while we are throwing as much money as we can at every little problem, we devalue the dollar that much more, and drive up our debt that much more. For absolutely nothing.

I understand your point, but there are a lot of ridiculous things at work.  A lot of companies are collectively sitting on hundreds of billions in reserve right now.  They're hesitant to make any significant investments (hiring new employees) because they don't know what Obama's going to do next.  At the end of last year, we came to an agreement to extend the evil "Bush tax cuts".  Unemployment began to fall from it's October high of 10.1%.  Just a few months later, there he goes again wanting to raise taxes on corporations and corporate jet owners.  You can't continually threaten the job creators and expect the economy to improve. 

Most of us have already known that throwing money at this problem isn't going to solve it.  The shovel-ready jobs infusion was a stupid idea.  He just created a bunch of temporary jobs in minimal ROI/non-productive sectors that don't self-sustain.  Once these public works  utilities use up the funds, they're just going to layoff the temporary workers.  If he was serious about creating long-term growth, he should have cut the corporate tax rate from 35% down to 20-30% and infuse the SBA with the funds used for the shovel-ready jobs programs.  Empower the SBA to offer low interest loans to small businesses and new startups with the strongest business cases.  Most of our workers are employed by small businesses.  This would have gone a long way to improving our situation. 
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RWS

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Re: This whole debt ceiling thing
« Reply #45 on: August 11, 2011, 06:09:22 PM »
Most of us have already known that throwing money at this problem isn't going to solve it.  The shovel-ready jobs infusion was a stupid idea.  He just created a bunch of temporary jobs in minimal ROI/non-productive sectors that don't self-sustain.  Once these public works  utilities use up the funds, they're just going to layoff the temporary workers.  If he was serious about creating long-term growth, he should have cut the corporate tax rate from 35% down to 20-30% and infuse the SBA with the funds used for the shovel-ready jobs programs.  Empower the SBA to offer low interest loans to small businesses and new startups with the strongest business cases.  Most of our workers are employed by small businesses.  This would have gone a long way to improving our situation.
As long as there are politicians with their hands in the money, unfortunately, this will never happen. The money will always go to wherever the pols interests lie. And that's really sad.
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GarMan

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Re: This whole debt ceiling thing
« Reply #46 on: August 12, 2011, 10:12:45 AM »
As long as there are politicians with their hands in the money, unfortunately, this will never happen. The money will always go to wherever the pols interests lie. And that's really sad. 

It's pretty close to Herman Cain's idea for an economic stimulus.  I have hope for change... 
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My rule of life prescribed as an absolutely sacred rite smoking cigars and also the drinking of alcohol before, after and if need be during all meals and in the intervals between them.  - Winston Churchill

Eating and sleeping are the only activities that should be allowed to interrupt a man's enjoyment of his cigar.  - Mark Twain

Nothing says "Obey Me" like a bloody head on a fence post!  - Stewie Griffin

"Every government interference in the economy consists of giving an unearned benefit, extorted by force, to some men at the expense of others."  - Ayn Rand

GH2001

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Re: This whole debt ceiling thing
« Reply #47 on: August 12, 2011, 01:18:44 PM »
It's pretty close to Herman Cain's idea for an economic stimulus.  I have hope for change...

I don't like him, but Newt put on an economic clinic last night.

Bachmann went off on Pawlenty as well.
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Tarheel

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Re: This whole debt ceiling thing
« Reply #48 on: August 12, 2011, 02:13:09 PM »
I don't like him, but Newt put on an economic clinic last night.

Bachmann went off on Pawlenty as well.

They truly dislike each other to put it politely.  I have heard them separately express dislike for one another in separate political radio interviews so the sparring between them last night did not surprise me.


I don't particularly care for Newt either but he did a good job last night.


Which reminds me I should probably start a separate thread on the debate...
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