Breaking Bad

[Kaos]

Hey, did you know that the Sopranos is a cheap knock off of The Godfather?

Yes.  Yes I did.  Godfather is my favorite movie of all time. 

Sopranos took elements of that, changed them around and ran with it.  Never hid the fact that it was an homage to Godfather right down to the use of oranges to foreshadow a death (or attempted death).  What was shattered when the two thugs took a shot at Tony?  A bottle of OJ. 

Not a criticism but BB isn't as deep.  I've yet to be truly surprised or awed by the storytelling.  Part of that is the cast. Walt is strong.  Gus was strong.  Jesse is decent.  The rest are really pretty weak.  Part of it may be the limits of A&E.  I've been waiting on a true WTF moment and there just hasn't been one. 

I had people tell me for weeks "wait until you see the turtle scene, it'll blow your mind."  After?  I was like -- really? That's it? They wasted a good actor, his motivations were never truly fleshed out, his character just popped in from nowhere and then that? 

Let's make a heirarchy chart: 

1) Godfather: The juxtaposition of the baptism and Michael settling all family business.  An absolutely masterful scene, nearly perfect in every way. 
2) Sopranos: Several to choose from, but the scene where Tony kills the turncoat rat in College was outstanding. Allowing the lead character to do something that reprehensible was a relative unknown. HBO balked and tried to get the scene killed, they were afraid people would turn away if they didn't have somebody to "root for"  David Chase stuck to his guns and the rest is history. That scene paved the way and made Walt possible.  But it's not as good as the baptism scene in Godfather.
3) BB: I am the danger.  Good scene, well orchestrated. 

You people are confused.  I like the show.  It compares favorably to my favorite TV show ever.  It has some good performances (skyler not among them, I loathe that bloated fucking cow).  I like the dynamic between Jesse and Walt (precisely BECAUSE it is very Tony/Chris in the way it plays out, so much so that it's almost an "alternate ending" if you will to the actual Tony/Chris storyline). 

There will never be another Godfather.  There will never be another Sopranos.  Doesn't mean I can't or don't appreciate shows that try, like this one. 

I have my own critiques, one of which is that it's not as deep (to me) as some want to make it. 

[Vandy Vol]

[GH2001]

Yes.  Yes I did.  Godfather is my favorite movie of all time. 

Sopranos took elements of that, changed them around and ran with it.  Never hid the fact that it was an homage to Godfather right down to the use of oranges to foreshadow a death (or attempted death).  What was shattered when the two thugs took a shot at Tony?  A bottle of OJ. 

Not a criticism but BB isn't as deep.  I've yet to be truly surprised or awed by the storytelling.  Part of that is the cast. Walt is strong.  Gus was strong.  Jesse is decent.  The rest are really pretty weak.  Part of it may be the limits of A&E.  I've been waiting on a true WTF moment and there just hasn't been one. 

I had people tell me for weeks "wait until you see the turtle scene, it'll blow your mind."  After?  I was like -- really? That's it? They wasted a good actor, his motivations were never truly fleshed out, his character just popped in from nowhere and then that? 

Let's make a heirarchy chart: 

1) Godfather: The juxtaposition of the baptism and Michael settling all family business.  An absolutely masterful scene, nearly perfect in every way. 
2) Sopranos: Several to choose from, but the scene where Tony kills the turncoat rat in College was outstanding. Allowing the lead character to do something that reprehensible was a relative unknown. HBO balked and tried to get the scene killed, they were afraid people would turn away if they didn't have somebody to "root for"  David Chase stuck to his guns and the rest is history. That scene paved the way and made Walt possible.  But it's not as good as the baptism scene in Godfather.
3) BB: I am the danger.  Good scene, well orchestrated. 

You people are confused.  I like the show.  It compares favorably to my favorite TV show ever.  It has some good performances (skyler not among them, I loathe that bloated fucking cow).  I like the dynamic between Jesse and Walt (precisely BECAUSE it is very Tony/Chris in the way it plays out, so much so that it's almost an "alternate ending" if you will to the actual Tony/Chris storyline). 

There will never be another Godfather.  There will never be another Sopranos.  Doesn't mean I can't or don't appreciate shows that try, like this one. 

I have my own critiques, one of which is that it's not as deep (to me) as some want to make it.

Love the Godfather. Watched it again Sunday.

[Townhallsavoy]

Sooooo, Todd killed a kid.  With a gloved hand.  Using a pistol.  One shot to the head from at least 30 meters away. 

[GH2001]

Sooooo, Todd killed a kid.  With a gloved hand.  Using a pistol.  One shot to the head from at least 30 meters away.

Until that happened, I was a little pissed that the episode (which had such a far fetched idea of robbing a train of meth.) was too wrapped up in a nice bow. I was watching for something to go wrong and it did.

[Kaos]

Sooooo, Todd killed a kid.  With a gloved hand.  Using a pistol.  One shot to the head from at least 30 meters away.

Ehhh...

Like the fact that Jesse is turning into the smart one, able to see the solution to problems while Walt and Mike bicker like old gay lovers.

Liked Lydia as the blacksmith in A Knight's Tale. 

The stealing from the train scenario was inspired.  Thought that was well done, well acted and well paced. 

I still hate Skyler with the passion of a thousand burning suns. She's a shitty actress and her character is a mommy part.  Should have let her drown.  Now would be a good time to accidentally overdose her ass and get her out of the picture. 

Any and all of the at-home scenes are now just wasted.  I want to turn the channel any time I see Skyler, Gimp Jr., Baby or Marie.  I could give a shit about any of them.  Also, whatever happened to the big Marie is a klepto storyline from a season or two back?  She just cured now and that whole setup was for nothing?

Wouldn't the DEA do regular bug sweeps of their offices?  Wouldn't they have detection devices in place?  Just saying. 

And where's Saul?  Need more Saul less Skyler, less Marie, less Gimpy McGimperson, less dumbass Hank.

I read the article where Vince says they're sort of making it up as they go along (as opposed to Sopranos which was done from start to finish in David Chase's head before the first episode aired and it showed in perpetual tautness -- with the exception of the HBO mandated bloated Season Six).  There are times I think that sort of reckless storytelling shows up in this series.  Sometimes it feels like they were sitting around and went "Oh, hell.. what if..." and then wrote an episode that was only loosely connected to the rest of the arc. 

Anyway, the train sequence was enough to carry this episode.  Was a good one.

[GH2001]

Ehhh...

Like the fact that Jesse is turning into the smart one, able to see the solution to problems while Walt and Mike bicker like old gay lovers.

Liked Lydia as the blacksmith in A Knight's Tale. 

The stealing from the train scenario was inspired.  Thought that was well done, well acted and well paced. 

I still hate Skyler with the passion of a thousand burning suns. She's a shitty actress and her character is a mommy part.  Should have let her drown.  Now would be a good time to accidentally overdose her ass and get her out of the picture. 

Any and all of the at-home scenes are now just wasted.  I want to turn the channel any time I see Skyler, Gimp Jr., Baby or Marie.  I could give a shit about any of them.  Also, whatever happened to the big Marie is a klepto storyline from a season or two back?  She just cured now and that whole setup was for nothing?

Wouldn't the DEA do regular bug sweeps of their offices?  Wouldn't they have detection devices in place?  Just saying. 

And where's Saul?  Need more Saul less Skyler, less Marie, less Gimpy McGimperson, less dumbass Hank.

I read the article where Vince says they're sort of making it up as they go along (as opposed to Sopranos which was done from start to finish in David Chase's head before the first episode aired and it showed in perpetual tautness -- with the exception of the HBO mandated bloated Season Six).  There are times I think that sort of reckless storytelling shows up in this series.  Sometimes it feels like they were sitting around and went "Oh, hell.. what if..." and then wrote an episode that was only loosely connected to the rest of the arc. 

Anyway, the train sequence was enough to carry this episode.  Was a good one.

See, I thought just the opposite of this one. It was too far fetched and could only be pulled off in a tv show. I just wasn't buying the Lydia pleading angle or them unloading the train car. All that just happened too easy. Ya think what they unloaded MAY NOT be meth? Just a thought.

Agree on Saul. We need more of him.

[Townhallsavoy]

See, I thought just the opposite of this one. It was too far fetched and could only be pulled off in a tv show. I just wasn't buying the Lydia pleading angle or them unloading the train car. All that just happened too easy. Ya think what they unloaded MAY NOT be meth? Just a thought.

Agree on Saul. We need more of him.

It was very unrealistic, but it was good enough to continue the love for the show. 

The "Jesse is the smart one" angle isn't one I particularly enjoy although I'm sure they're setting up a break up between Jesse and Walt.

Walt is primarily concerned with being king...or Emperor if you watched the preview.  He doesn't care about meth.  He doesn't care about money.  He cares about his pride. 

Jesse wants to make money selling meth, and the business of making and selling meth is a fun activity for him.  He doesn't want to see people die for it.  Definitely not a kid. 

And where is Saul?  And the Mexican cartels which definitely aren't going to go away just because Gus and Don Eladio are dead? 

[Kaos]

See, I thought just the opposite of this one. It was too far fetched and could only be pulled off in a tv show. I just wasn't buying the Lydia pleading angle or them unloading the train car. All that just happened too easy. Ya think what they unloaded MAY NOT be meth? Just a thought.

Agree on Saul. We need more of him.

The reality of whether it could happen or not was irrelevant to me.  I was looking only at the relative entertainment value. 

I watched that stupid Ghost Protocol movie over the weekend.  Can a man REALLY leap out of a car going 100 mph, roll once and pop up to start running?  Can a guy have a head on collision at 100 mph, flip the car twice and be off and running down the street ten seconds later?  Can somebody really drive a car off a 100-foot drop and survive the fall in suffificent physical and mental shape to work on a computer? 

For that matter could anybody really live through the shit that routinely happens in Bourne movies, Indiana Jones movies, Rambo movies, Rocky movies and so on?  Pffffttttt.  Hell no. 

When you're talking about things that are far-fetched and unrealistic on Breaking Bad, I submit that the very fact that Walt is alive is more far-fetched than any train theft.  In the real world, Tuco, Crazy 8, Gus, the Cartel and eight or nine other people would have killed his naive ass years ago.  He might have lived three weeks. 

It's easier for me to accept that they could rob a train than it is for me to accept that he wasn't killed the first day he started cooking. 

[GH2001]

The reality of whether it could happen or not was irrelevant to me.  I was looking only at the relative entertainment value. 

I watched that stupid Ghost Protocol movie over the weekend.  Can a man REALLY leap out of a car going 100 mph, roll once and pop up to start running?  Can a guy have a head on collision at 100 mph, flip the car twice and be off and running down the street ten seconds later?  Can somebody really drive a car off a 100-foot drop and survive the fall in suffificent physical and mental shape to work on a computer? 

For that matter could anybody really live through the shit that routinely happens in Bourne movies, Indiana Jones movies, Rambo movies, Rocky movies and so on?  Pffffttttt.  Hell no. 

When you're talking about things that are far-fetched and unrealistic on Breaking Bad, I submit that the very fact that Walt is alive is more far-fetched than any train theft.  In the real world, Tuco, Crazy 8, Gus, the Cartel and eight or nine other people would have killed his naive ass years ago.  He might have lived three weeks. 

It's easier for me to accept that they could rob a train than it is for me to accept that he wasn't killed the first day he started cooking.

I expect that in a shitty action movie with Cruise.

And yeah, the whole show has gotten further than it ever shouldve but the train heist just really was out there. How it was pulled off just perfectly just in time. I really would like to know what the fall out, if any, is from it. Not enough water pumped back in, something not screwed back on right, not meth, the kid being shot, etc. I was just looking for something to get fucked up before the end credits.

[wesfau2]

Neither Walt nor Mike have the DEA connection.  That's a holdover from the Gus days, and someone is getting nervous that Hank is sniffing around a little too well.  I theorized a while back that Gus had a high-ranking buddy in the DEA...we're about to find out who it is.

Skylar sucks, but the pool incident wasn't a psychotic break, she planned it and got the intended result: the kids are out of the house.

Todd is an interesting guy.  Violates Mike's rules about speaking to Jesse and Walt (nanny-cam) and then whips out a pistol and expertly, without hesitation, shoots a kid.  He's not just some low-level B&E expert.  His bosses are going to see that Walt and Jesse have potential, but are small-timing.  There will be a job offer and it might possibly tie in with the DEA bigwig.

[Vandy Vol]

Neither Walt nor Mike have the DEA connection.  That's a holdover from the Gus days, and someone is getting nervous that Hank is sniffing around a little too well.  I theorized a while back that Gus had a high-ranking buddy in the DEA...we're about to find out who it is.

Holdover from where?  Lydia doesn't seem to have anyone who's able to protect her and she's being investigated by the DEA.  As the previous supplier of Gus, wouldn't someone who was a holdover from Gus's operation try to protect the supplier before protecting the guy who destroyed your operation?

The only way I can think that this might work is if Gus's connection is still in contact with Mike, and their ultimate plan is to make Walt think he's working for himself when, in actuality, he's making money for someone else just like he did with Gus.  Because Walt has a history of killing his employers, the only way to employ Walt and not encounter issues is to not have him know about his own employment.  It's possible that Mike is taking more money out than is needed for the hush money, and is secretly paying Gus's connection.

But, based upon the most recent preview, I doubt this is the case.  If Mike is involved with the DEA connection, then the DEA wouldn't be tailing him like the preview showed.

If Gus's DEA contact is not being paid for Walt's work, then I see no reason why they would bother to protect Walt.  I don't see how discovering Walt's operation would uncover the DEA contact's dealings with Gus, as there shouldn't be any evidence linking Walt and any DEA agent (other than Hank, of course).

Todd is an interesting guy.  Violates Mike's rules about speaking to Jesse and Walt (nanny-cam) and then whips out a pistol and expertly, without hesitation, shoots a kid.  He's not just some low-level B&E expert.  His bosses are going to see that Walt and Jesse have potential, but are small-timing.  There will be a job offer and it might possibly tie in with the DEA bigwig.

I'm not sure about that.  Saul had represented the Vamonos Pest company for five years.  Had the company been under the control of some mob boss, then Saul probably wouldn't have suggested it.  Afterall, you can't just come in and buy a company out from under an organized crime ring.

One possible way around that is to presume that Saul wanted to get back at Walt for putting him in his place and effectively enslaving him through fear.  If Vamonos Pest is operated by some mob boss, then Walt would be confronted and potentially taken out, solving Saul's problem.  But then why would Saul suggest numerous other potential covers before bringing him to Vamonos Pest?  That wouldn't fit either.

But, I do definitely think there will be something revealed about Todd.  I recall that Hank asked Junior if he wanted to watch Heat.  Correspondingly, that movie involved a botched heist due to a new team member who turned out to be something that none of them knew about.  And the heist was botched because he shot a guard.

[wesfau2]

Holdover from where?  Lydia doesn't seem to have anyone who's able to protect her and she's being investigated by the DEA.  As the previous supplier of Gus, wouldn't someone who was a holdover from Gus's operation try to protect the supplier before protecting the guy who destroyed your operation?

The only way I can think that this might work is if Gus's connection is still in contact with Mike, and their ultimate plan is to make Walt think he's working for himself when, in actuality, he's making money for someone else just like he did with Gus.  Because Walt has a history of killing his employers, the only way to employ Walt and not encounter issues is to not have him know about his own employment.  It's possible that Mike is taking more money out than is needed for the hush money, and is secretly paying Gus's connection.

But, based upon the most recent preview, I doubt this is the case.  If Mike is involved with the DEA connection, then the DEA wouldn't be tailing him like the preview showed.

If Gus's DEA contact is not being paid for Walt's work, then I see no reason why they would bother to protect Walt.  I don't see how discovering Walt's operation would uncover the DEA contact's dealings with Gus, as there shouldn't be any evidence linking Walt and any DEA agent (other than Hank, of course).

Good stuff, and I really don't know what to think about it all.  Could be that Gus's DEA connection is in contact with Saul...who is in contact with Mike so that the money train keeps rolling.  I just don't think that Mike is dialed into the DEA, he's got too much negative criminal baggage. 

I'm not sure about that.  Saul had represented the Vamonos Pest company for five years.  Had the company been under the control of some mob boss, then Saul probably wouldn't have suggested it.  Afterall, you can't just come in and buy a company out from under an organized crime ring.

One possible way around that is to presume that Saul wanted to get back at Walt for putting him in his place and effectively enslaving him through fear.  If Vamonos Pest is operated by some mob boss, then Walt would be confronted and potentially taken out, solving Saul's problem.  But then why would Saul suggest numerous other potential covers before bringing him to Vamonos Pest?  That wouldn't fit either.

But, I do definitely think there will be something revealed about Todd.  I recall that Hank asked Junior if he wanted to watch Heat.  Correspondingly, that movie involved a botched heist due to a new team member who turned out to be something that none of them knew about.  And the heist was botched because he shot a guard.

Yeah, I'm stretching with the Vamanos angle.  Just don't have enough info yet to make any educated guesses.  Good point about the "Heat" tie-in.  I hadn't considered that.

[Kaos]

I think you're still thinking about it more than the show's creator/writer even has. 

[wesfau2]

I think you're still thinking about it more than the show's creator/writer even has.

Your repetitive and unhelpful contribution is duly noted.

[Townhallsavoy]

Anyone else think this first 8 of the final season is mainly setting up Walt's empire? 

He's being separated from his family.  The kids are out, and Skylar is becoming more like a zombie.

He's taking full control of the operation.  We see how they're going to cook.  They've gotten the Methlymine.  Mike wants out and Todd could be the hitman. 

If you watched the season 5 preview before the first episode, you probably noticed Jesse partying with Puff Daddy.  I doubt Jesse can party with Puff Daddy at this point right now.  Even if PDiddy isn't playing himself but just another rich drug dealer/millionaire, Jesse still isn't in position to party with anyone right now. 

So the season is definitely on point to put Walt and Jesse at the pinnacle of success.  There's only three episodes left.  I can't see them suddenly deviating from the current plot right before the mini-season finale. 

Further, we know that season 5 part 2 includes Walt's 52nd birthday.  I highly doubt - especially with the pace the show has had in its existence - that they suddenly jump ahead a year within three episodes.

So if I had to guess, I'd say that Walt and Jesse finish this mini-season by establishing themselves as the meth empire and episode 9 takes place after a long period of sustained success with Walt and Jesse. 

Then part ii of season 5 is Walt's undoing and it will probably be very similar to Gus's undoing. 

[GH2001]

I think you're still thinking about it more than the show's creator/writer even has.

Yes, for the 12th time - we know.  What the hell do you care?

Now shut the fuck up and let us get back to discussing things that may or may not be happening.

[GH2001]

Anyone else think this first 8 of the final season is mainly setting up Walt's empire? 

He's being separated from his family.  The kids are out, and Skylar is becoming more like a zombie.

He's taking full control of the operation.  We see how they're going to cook.  They've gotten the Methlymine.  Mike wants out and Todd could be the hitman. 

If you watched the season 5 preview before the first episode, you probably noticed Jesse partying with Puff Daddy.  I doubt Jesse can party with Puff Daddy at this point right now.  Even if PDiddy isn't playing himself but just another rich drug dealer/millionaire, Jesse still isn't in position to party with anyone right now. 

So the season is definitely on point to put Walt and Jesse at the pinnacle of success.  There's only three episodes left.  I can't see them suddenly deviating from the current plot right before the mini-season finale. 

Further, we know that season 5 part 2 includes Walt's 52nd birthday.  I highly doubt - especially with the pace the show has had in its existence - that they suddenly jump ahead a year within three episodes.

So if I had to guess, I'd say that Walt and Jesse finish this mini-season by establishing themselves as the meth empire and episode 9 takes place after a long period of sustained success with Walt and Jesse. 

Then part ii of season 5 is Walt's undoing and it will probably be very similar to Gus's undoing.

Good theory and not too far out there either.

[Kaos]

Yes, for the 12th time - we know.  What the hell do you care?

Now shut the fuck up and let us get back to discussing things that may or may not be happening.

No.  And no. 

[GH2001]

No.  And no.

Shouldn't you be jerking off to Michael Corleone shooting it up in a resturaunt?